Speaker A [00:00:00]: I can name for you 10 people off the top of my head that say to me, tell me that their partners have said, okay, Aaron.
Speaker B [00:00:09]: Oh, people say to me all the time.
Speaker A [00:00:10]: Okay. About you, Aaron. Yes. All right, Aaron. What else do you have to say? Aaron. But they’re really talking to their partners because they do not believe that their partner ever in a million years could have concocted anything that sounds at all like what they’re saying. Unless they were influenced by me. Like I’m some freaking cult leader or something.
Speaker B [00:00:29]: People say it to me all the time.
Speaker A [00:00:30]: Exactly.
Speaker B [00:00:31]: Including, I mean, everybody.
Speaker A [00:00:32]: Yeah. What? Okay, Erin.
Speaker B [00:00:34]: Yeah, all the time.
Speaker A [00:00:35]: Because you’re not capable of having your own thoughts and opinions. Like, you’re just so highly walking around influenced all of the time. Like, our whole conversations is not. Here’s your answer, Rebecca. And you go traipsing right back into your home, and you say this, that, and the other thing. I would never. I would never. But the thought that I’m that highly influential. Thank you. I guess, to people. We got a good one today.
Speaker B [00:01:17]: I know. I’m excited.
Speaker A [00:01:18]: Another good one.
Speaker B [00:01:19]: So we always have good ones.
Speaker A [00:01:20]: I know. Well, at least we think we do. I don’t know what everybody else thinks. I mean, to be honest, the Facebook page is growing and growing.
Speaker B [00:01:27]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:01:28]: I think yesterday I approved seven new people to be a part of our Facebook community, which is really awesome.
Speaker C [00:01:35]: Some of them were Russian. That was.
Speaker A [00:01:37]: No, they were not. So random. From people trying to just impact our SEO or whatever the heck they’re trying to do. Yeah. So real life. Seven real life people. So we must be talking about something somebody cares about, which is good. Oh, wow. You got to read all those comments.
Speaker B [00:01:53]: We’re not doing that. That’s a lot of reading. Okay, we’re going to keep going. Keep going.
Speaker A [00:01:57]: So our last session was on reframing your love story, and that was essentially, how do we need to look at our marriage, our partnerships, our relationship from a different perspective? And I think that was a good session, too.
Speaker B [00:02:12]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:02:13]: Last one, though. Let me frame this question for you.
Speaker B [00:02:15]: I’m excited.
Speaker A [00:02:16]: Who influences your marriage? I mean, who influences. Maybe the title should be who influences your marriage and why is it your best friend? I kind of like that. Oh, it’s that guy. All right, so that’s what we’re going to be diving into today. We’re going to be talking about the good, the bad, the ugly, about who influences your marriage, why they influence, and just some cautionary tales. If someone is influencing your marriage, just to be aware of and to be mindful of as you continue to move through. So join us today if that is a topic of interest to you.
Speaker B [00:02:49]: To me, yes.
Speaker A [00:02:51]: So, as always, the hippie voo. The hippie vu tarot.
Speaker B [00:02:57]: The hippie voo of the hippie vous.
Speaker A [00:02:58]: As a part of the More Love podcast will guide us in all of our future conversations for today’s session. So who is this man?
Speaker B [00:03:06]: As well you know, our new version.
Speaker A [00:03:09]: Okay.
Speaker B [00:03:09]: We’re doing it live.
Speaker A [00:03:10]: Yes.
Speaker B [00:03:11]: You know. Yeah, live on there.
Speaker A [00:03:12]: What she means by that is she shuffles the cards, and when one falls out, it’s the spirit.
Speaker B [00:03:17]: Instead of doing it during. During our prep, I’m doing it, you know, Right. Right on the show. So this is King Triton, okay? The King of the ocean. And it’s order. He’s sitting in his merman throne, and he is looking straight out with his.
Speaker A [00:03:35]: Can I see the card spear thing?
Speaker B [00:03:37]: His. What is that thing called? Wand?
Speaker A [00:03:39]: I don’t know.
Speaker C [00:03:39]: Trident.
Speaker B [00:03:40]: Trident, yes, trident. He’s the father figure.
Speaker A [00:03:43]: He’s got some great abs.
Speaker B [00:03:44]: I know, it’s kind of hot. So order. The King of the ocean is a symbol of order. So if chaos has ruled recently, know that order and balance will soon be restored. If any boundaries have been crossed, you will be able to reassert your territory. And for this reason, he reveals an end to the disputes. At home, you will soon be getting more organized. And at work, good leadership and management reign. As a person, the king is the ideal partner. Or he stands for a father figure or father. And he stands for a father or father figure. So it’s time to get your work, finances, or home in order and take control to protect your assets. You have the power. Very interesting.
Speaker A [00:04:22]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:04:22]: Very interesting. So focus, protection, wisdom, organization, authority, leadership, and boundaries. Wow, that’s so interesting based on what we’re going to talk about today.
Speaker A [00:04:31]: I know.
Speaker B [00:04:32]: Story of our life.
Speaker A [00:04:33]: So who influences your marriage? Scott, if you could come into the bubble, please.
Speaker B [00:04:38]: That’s all right, Scott.
Speaker A [00:04:39]: We are just going to do what we call a rift, where I’m going to say, who influences your marriage? This doesn’t have to be your marriage in particular, but let’s just brainstorm out loud all of the people or the influences that potentially have some say or even if it’s subliminal in your marriage.
Speaker B [00:04:58]: Okay.
Speaker A [00:04:59]: So ready, Scott? I’m going to start. Your neighbors. Ooh, Your neighbors. Your own parents. Go ahead, guys, Anytime you want to throw something out here, it’s totally fine. Oh, yeah.
Speaker B [00:05:16]: It’s like, for us personally, yes.
Speaker A [00:05:17]: Anyone. Yeah. Or anyone.
Speaker B [00:05:18]: For me, it’s the Real Housewives franchise.
Speaker A [00:05:21]: Okay. Yeah, Yep. Love that.
Speaker B [00:05:23]: For sure.
Speaker A [00:05:23]: Yeah. The Bachelor.
Speaker C [00:05:27]: Nobody influences my.
Speaker B [00:05:29]: Oh, oh, okay. Okay.
Speaker A [00:05:31]: This podcast does, Scott.
Speaker B [00:05:32]: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A [00:05:34]: Okay.
Speaker B [00:05:35]: The. The. The groups I work for.
Speaker A [00:05:40]: Yeah, right.
Speaker B [00:05:40]: Very much so.
Speaker A [00:05:41]: Yes, very much. Because you’re so embedded in a bunch of different communities that are very unique and different from the traditional, you know, middle class.
Speaker B [00:05:50]: Yes.
Speaker A [00:05:51]: Family life. Oh, yeah, That’s a good one.
Speaker B [00:05:53]: Yes. And we’re always dissecting marriages.
Speaker A [00:05:55]: Yeah, yeah, Yep. That’s a good one. I would say some of the relationships I’ve seen on Instagram. Oh, yeah, yeah. So a little social media influence there.
Speaker B [00:06:05]: My friends. Relationships.
Speaker A [00:06:07]: Yep. Yeah. My best friends.
Speaker B [00:06:10]: Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A [00:06:11]: For sure. Influence my marriage via the conversations that we have.
Speaker B [00:06:15]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:06:16]: On the regular. You. Yeah, you, you. I mean, see, Scott just left bubble. Just went. He’s like, I’m all set with this. I’m all done. I’m not going to be influenced.
Speaker C [00:06:26]: Kelly’s friends influence our relationship in a way that. Because all of her friends. I don’t even know if I should say this. Most of her friends are married to douchebags.
Speaker A [00:06:37]: Oh, okay.
Speaker B [00:06:38]: All right. Okay.
Speaker C [00:06:39]: And so she gets to revel in the fact that I am not a douchebag.
Speaker A [00:06:43]: Oh. So she gets. She has a positive influence because she gets to sit there.
Speaker C [00:06:47]: She gets that positive reinforcement like, n. Look how good I have it. As compared to.
Speaker A [00:06:51]: That’s interesting. Okay, that’s a good one.
Speaker B [00:06:53]: She gets to brag.
Speaker A [00:06:54]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:06:55]: Okay.
Speaker A [00:06:55]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:06:55]: All right.
Speaker A [00:06:56]: Yep. That’s a good one.
Speaker B [00:06:57]: All right.
Speaker A [00:06:58]: I like this. If anything else comes up, feel free to shoot it out. But I think what’s interesting about this is so many people, even people we don’t even know, are influencing our relationships on a consistent basis.
Speaker B [00:07:14]: Oh, I just thought of one.
Speaker A [00:07:16]: Who?
Speaker B [00:07:16]: The murder mysteries we watch.
Speaker A [00:07:18]: Oh. Oh, yeah. Oh. Oh, for sure.
Speaker B [00:07:21]: My favorite was that thing you sent me the other day of the woman who’s creating her own binder.
Speaker A [00:07:26]: Oh, my God.
Speaker B [00:07:27]: Of who was going to.
Speaker A [00:07:27]: Kelly on the street sent that to me. I pissed myself. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She had a binder.
Speaker C [00:07:34]: The people to look at.
Speaker A [00:07:35]: This video is hilarious, Scott. It’s like an entire binder full of, like, if I’m ever on Dateline, here’s some images I want them to use of me that are my best images. My favorite was when she was like, here’s some of my best friends who do this their best. Staring off into the distance pose Right. While life thinking while they’re thinking about my death over a glass of water, like, oh my God.
Speaker B [00:08:01]: And here is the worst picture of my husband because he’s the number one suspect.
Speaker A [00:08:04]: That’s right. That’s right.
Speaker C [00:08:07]: Anybody who knows who watches those shows knows that you don’t have antifreeze at your house.
Speaker A [00:08:14]: That’s right.
Speaker C [00:08:14]: And Succinyl Cola.
Speaker A [00:08:15]: And you do not use your own search bar to search things like how much antifreeze does it take off my husband?
Speaker C [00:08:23]: How do I kill my wife if not get caught.
Speaker A [00:08:25]: That’s right. That’s right. That’s a great. That’s a good one. That’s a really good one. That’s another influence. So we sure as shit know that all of these things are influencing us. But in this topic, I was really honing in on the best friendship relationship. And when you have very close people in your life, they certainly are the people you’re gonna go to that you’re gonna share all the down dirty details about. This is what’s working, what’s not working. Very rarely, even in our own relationship do I think we’re flocking to each other when things are so beaut wonderful that we are just like, oh my God, let me tell you this very sweet thing that just happened. I mean, it does happen, but it happens pales in comparison to when we’re pissed at our spouses or they did something that annoys us or whatever. Right. And so I think about this best friendship dynamic and I think about the relationships we have with people. And really, for real, what influence does it have when you run to your closest friends to talk about what’s working or not working in your partnership? And that’s what I’m hoping we can dive into a little bit today. To either of you have any examples about ways in which you’ve leaned into someone and it has had an impact on your marriage?
Speaker B [00:09:44]: Positive or negative?
Speaker A [00:09:45]: Yeah, either one. You too, Scott.
Speaker C [00:09:50]: Crickets. I really can’t think. I mean, the only thing that really had a real positive impact on my marriage was the marriage counseling. I mean, I can’t. I guess I’m boring in the fact that I don’t have very many friends that I go and hang out with all the time. And definitely I can’t think of it. Maybe one of my friends would be someone that I would look to for marriage advice. The rest of them, not so much.
Speaker B [00:10:24]: It’s funny you say that. I’m kind of tight lipped when it comes to sharing things, specifically when it comes to being vulnerable, number one. Number two, I Don’t really value a lot of advice from other people when I look at their lives, because what I’m watching them do is not something that I’m blown away by or admire. Therefore, they aren’t going to give me any advice that would matter. Because, frankly, actions speak louder than words. And therefore, the people that I’m inspired by or am going to be influenced by are. I don’t need to talk to. I just need to watch and take action by.
Speaker A [00:11:24]: Interesting.
Speaker B [00:11:24]: Does that make sense?
Speaker A [00:11:25]: Yes. And you’ve always been very selective about your.
Speaker B [00:11:27]: Very selective.
Speaker A [00:11:29]: Who’s in your inner circle, and then who are you going to be taking?
Speaker B [00:11:32]: Yes. And I’ll talk and I talk through. I talk through my own emotions and my own things because I learned very early on that I can’t change other people. I can only change me. So I talk through those things with you and then work through what I need to work through and then decide, is it worth it? And then once I do that, then I look to other examples on how to implement that. Does that make sense?
Speaker A [00:11:55]: Yes.
Speaker B [00:11:55]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:11:56]: Yeah. And I would say I’m completely dissimilar from the two of you. I would say I have four or five key people that I go to consistently as, like, sounding boards for all things.
Speaker B [00:12:11]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:12:12]: Yeah. Now, I might go to you each differently for different topics or a range of topics.
Speaker B [00:12:18]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:12:19]: But when I think about this a little deeper, maybe some of where this has come from was I’ve spent a great majority of my life just listening to other people and not feeling close to other people, because I would always wait for them to want to be interested in what was happening in my life, and that would never come. So I was just everyone’s counselor in my friend group for a very, very, very long time. Somewhere along the way, that shifted for me. And I thought, if you really want to have genuinely close relationships with people, you can’t just wait to be invited into those conversations. You have to offer something up. And so I would step very slowly into these relationships, and then I would. I would be like, do I like that? Do I not like that? Can you handle this? Can you not handle this? Right. I don’t think it was conscious always on my part, but. And then because of that, I really developed four to five beautifully close women friendships that I feel get me to my core and most importantly, I feel can be biased toward me, but not in hatred of my partner. Does that make sense? Yes, it is. They’re always gonna cheer me on. They’re always gonna want what’s best for me. They are willing to push back and say, I don’t know, let me just think about that from a different perspective. Or have you thought that maybe this is happening, but never. Have I surrounded myself, at least in this really small group with people who are like, here’s your answer. You just need to do this. There is no other option here and you need to call it a day. Or have I surrounded myself with people who are just so anti my partner that they can’t show me some of the goodness at the times where I’m most pissed or most upset about something?
Speaker B [00:14:27]: Well, I don’t think you would be able to hear that. And I don’t know if you would even be able to spend time around people who would say things to you like that. How could you possibly be around people who would say bad things about people you love? I couldn’t be.
Speaker A [00:14:43]: I think a lot of people, so long as they get validated in the feedback they’re getting from someone else, don’t care who it hurts, really.
Speaker B [00:14:55]: Maybe that’s why I’m so tight lipped, because I feel very strongly. I mean, you know how I go 0 to 100 if I am vulnerable for even a tiny little second and if somebody says one thing that’s off about somebody that I love? I can’t. I can’t. Right, Scott? Yeah, Right, Scott?
Speaker A [00:15:15]: Right.
Speaker B [00:15:15]: You like my texts?
Speaker C [00:15:16]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:15:19]: I forgot about that.
Speaker B [00:15:21]: I can’t. I really. I really struggle with that.
Speaker A [00:15:27]: You guys. That has to be an episode.
Speaker B [00:15:29]: I don’t.
Speaker A [00:15:30]: I have to talk about that again. Experience on a future episode. No, we did not.
Speaker B [00:15:35]: We did not.
Speaker A [00:15:36]: We have to talk about that. Coming up on the More Love podcast. The time where the podcast almost blew up.
Speaker C [00:15:43]: Oh, no, it did blow up.
Speaker A [00:15:44]: It blew up and then came back together. And then in the beautiful comfort of the.
Speaker B [00:15:50]: There almost was no season three. But that’s. But that’s how I am. Like, I. That’s why I don’t get vulnerable and I don’t allow that kind of thing to show because if I don’t go there, then I don’t have to go there. And then when I do go there, it’s very hard to come back because you can’t do things to the people that I love.
Speaker A [00:16:17]: Interesting.
Speaker B [00:16:18]: You just can’t.
Speaker A [00:16:18]: And the way I can relate with that is I don’t like to have to be on the defensive for someone that I’m mad at. So if I’m real pissed at Mark because he’s done something that I just can’t and then someone comes in with how much they can’t stand Mark or why what he’s doing is absolutely inappropriate and should be different. I feel like I have to protect him, to share the other side of the story. And then I’m pissed about that. I’m pissed that I have to. Why now? I have to be like, no, I know I hate him right now. He’s pissed me off, but he’s not a terrible human, and here’s why. And now I’m pissed that I have to even support him in this conversation. I just want to be mad at him. I don’t want you to also jump on board with hating him. Right. Exactly. At the same time, because I’m the one who gets to hate him right now. You just have to sit there and hate me. Like. Like just hating him. Right. Because I might get over it.
Speaker B [00:17:12]: No, you will get over it.
Speaker A [00:17:13]: Like, right.
Speaker C [00:17:14]: I just need something to vent to.
Speaker A [00:17:16]: Right.
Speaker C [00:17:16]: Just someone.
Speaker A [00:17:17]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:17:18]: Right.
Speaker A [00:17:18]: But this level of influence is so fascinating and so important. You’ve seen on these reality TV shows where these best friends will come in. You know, this is also real life. These best friends come in and they are the end all. Be all of the deciding fact of what’s going on in that relationship. That’s right. They are the person that you run to. They are the person that you kibits with. They are the person that ultimately, what they say holds way more weight than it does in your own relationship. In some cases, what they say matters more than how you feel about it. Because I think people just surrender themselves to saying, I just don’t have an answer. But Rebecca knows me better than anyone, and so I’m just gonna trust what she has to say in this. Right? Right. And so sort of trying to figure out what is healthy delegation of a conversation versus what is emotional avoidance of you managing it yourself is really fricking hard.
Speaker B [00:18:17]: Oh, yeah? Yeah.
Speaker A [00:18:18]: And then I can’t from a psychological perspective also not think, what is the motivation on the part of the listener, on the part of the best friend of the neighbor, of whomever. Right. Because if that is not in check, it’s like a therapist who’s gone rogue, you know? So, like, you’re trained as a therapist to recognize where your own counter transference or transference may be coming in experiences you’ve had in your own past life that are gonna trigger someone else. For instance, if I’m a therapist and I’m divorced and I’m a couples therapist and I’m meeting with a couple and Something that the husband did was something that my husband did that triggered my divorce. I am apt psychologically to encourage a divorce in that situation for a multitude of different reasons. You trained the therapist to recognize that and then not go there because that’s not your job. Friends aren’t trained like that. So let’s say one of your friends in a miserable marriage hates their marriage so much misery, loves company.
Speaker B [00:19:26]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:19:27]: Right. I know. And then let’s say that I just think from the partner’s perspective. If I think about Mark and Philip, they really have to be real on board with the fact that you and I are so close that Philip has to keep me close, and Mark needs to keep you close because of the level of influence that can exist there if we are unchecked.
Speaker B [00:19:54]: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A [00:19:55]: Unreal levels of influence.
Speaker B [00:19:58]: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A [00:19:59]: Thank God we’re perfect. We don’t have this problem.
Speaker B [00:20:00]: I know, but.
Speaker A [00:20:03]: But really, when you think about the potential unhealthy boundaries that can exist in a lot of these relationships.
Speaker B [00:20:10]: Oh, oh, and the. And the potential for threat. The potential for. If you come out of nowhere in Mark’s perception, and he could 100% be like, oh, what were you talking about, Rebecca?
Speaker A [00:20:24]: Oh, my God.
Speaker B [00:20:24]: Oh, what were you. Oh, oh.
Speaker A [00:20:26]: You know, this happens in my life. A ridiculous.
Speaker B [00:20:31]: People say that to you?
Speaker A [00:20:33]: No, no, not about the opposite. I swear to God, I can name for you 10 people off the top of my head that say to me. Tell me that their partners have said, okay, Aaron.
Speaker B [00:20:46]: Oh, people say to me all the time.
Speaker A [00:20:47]: Okay, about you, Aaron. Yes. All right, Aaron. What else do you have to say? Aaron. But they’re really talking to their partners because they do not believe that their partner ever in a million years could have concocted. Concocted anything that sounds at all like what they’re saying unless they were influenced by me. Like I’m some freaking cult leader or something.
Speaker B [00:21:06]: People say it to me all the time, Including, I mean, everybody.
Speaker A [00:21:09]: Yeah. What? Okay, Aaron.
Speaker B [00:21:11]: Yeah, all the time.
Speaker A [00:21:13]: Because you’re not capable of having your own thoughts and opinions. Like, you’re just so highly walking around influenced all of the time. And what’s most fascinating to me is a majority of our conversations is me asking you questions.
Speaker B [00:21:25]: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A [00:21:25]: Tell me more about that. Well, what do you think about that? I do have some thoughts on that. Do you think that this is related? Like, our whole conversations is not. Here’s your answer, Rebecca. And you go traipsing right back into your home, and you say this, that, and the other thing I wouldn’t. I would never. I would never. But the thought that I’m that highly influential. Thank you. I guess, to people.
Speaker B [00:21:47]: My entire training in my education has been to ask thoughtful questions. I’m a teacher. I’m a. I’m a. What is that?
Speaker A [00:21:58]: I teach.
Speaker B [00:21:58]: No, I teach the health educator. Yes. And I taught seminars and leadership workshops for 20 years to students. That’s my MO. That’s what I do. Right.
Speaker A [00:22:10]: So. Oh, my God, I’ve heard it so much from people who will come to me and say, well, I was telling them this. This. And I was going through what we talked about, and all I got was, okay, Erin.
Speaker B [00:22:22]: Yeah, I know.
Speaker A [00:22:23]: Apparently I’m just alive and well in everyone’s relationships. You know, it’s really fascinating.
Speaker B [00:22:29]: Well, it’s because I’m known for being the ditzy, dumb, psycho person. So when I come. So when I do talk in quote, unquote, therapeutic terms.
Speaker A [00:22:39]: Yes. Right.
Speaker B [00:22:40]: That’s when I become Aaron the therapist, because I’m not capable of having an intelligent conversation because I am the ditzy, dumb blonde that can’t possibly be intelligent. So the minute I become that.
Speaker A [00:22:58]: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker B [00:22:59]: I must have been. Yeah.
Speaker A [00:23:01]: It’s so starkly influenced.
Speaker B [00:23:03]: Yes.
Speaker A [00:23:03]: The other time I see it come up is when the partner asserts their rights.
Speaker B [00:23:08]: Oh. Yeah.
Speaker A [00:23:08]: So when the partner says, this is inappropriate and we shouldn’t be doing this anymore. Okay, Aaron. So, I mean, I really thank you, everybody. I just like to take a moment that the times where people feel you’ve been influenced are when you’re fighting for your own rights in your relationship or when you say something intelligent or therapeutic, or when you actually take the conversation a little bit more than just surface level bullshit and decide that we want to impact people’s experiences. Those are all Aaronisms, apparently. Awesome. That’s awesome. I can think of a whole lot of other things that I would not want my name associated with, but if that’s the case, great. Right.
Speaker B [00:23:45]: It’s really interesting. So that begs the question, are you a threat?
Speaker A [00:23:53]: Interesting.
Speaker B [00:23:53]: And I would say yes. I would say. I would say no.
Speaker A [00:23:57]: Honestly, that’s a fascinating question.
Speaker B [00:24:00]: I would ask those partners. I would ask those partners, if they were to be completely honest, those people would not want their partners going to you to have conversations.
Speaker A [00:24:10]: Right? That’s right. And I become a threat because I think part of my style of questioning is making people think differently about their experience. Sure. And in addition to that, really get clear on who they are and what they want.
Speaker B [00:24:26]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:24:26]: And those are things I don’t think come in many natural, normal conversations. So it really is that person just asserting. I have some more clarity now, but that’s very threatening. Of course it is. To a dynamic in a relationship that has either been allowed to be dysfunctional or has been uncomfortable or in a different power dynamic. That’s all it is than it has.
Speaker B [00:24:50]: Exactly.
Speaker A [00:24:51]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:24:51]: It’s real.
Speaker A [00:24:52]: Really? That’s really interesting.
Speaker B [00:24:53]: Exactly. And my husband’s just been. He’s been around from the beginning, so.
Speaker A [00:24:57]: He’S just used to it. He just knows his role. He just used Toast is wrong. Yeah, but so from a partner’s perspective, I think it’s interesting if the other person, let’s say the best friend on the other side of the coin, is impartial and has the best interest of the relationship at heart. I think that that serves as a really beautiful opportunity to reflect and to refocus on that relationship. If however, the partner, the best friend, is very one sided and is biased and does not like the, let’s say, husband in this case, then I do think that is a threat. I do think that it becomes a situation where every time you run to me to talk about something, if your husband doesn’t trust that I’m coming from a place of peace and fairness, he’s not gonna love that relationship. Right. And the question begs for me, is that a partner problem or is that a best friend problem?
Speaker B [00:26:02]: That’s a great question.
Speaker A [00:26:04]: You know, whose problem is that?
Speaker B [00:26:11]: That’s a really good question. I just keep going back to the fact that the Secret Life of Mormons Wives just came out.
Speaker A [00:26:17]: Sure did. I started watching it and I had to stop. It was too much for me.
Speaker B [00:26:21]: Okay, well, I was listening to the Sirius XM radio station with Andy Cohen because I love Bravo and all that shit. And they were talking about specifically Mormons in Utah and how the phenomenon with Mormon women and how typically that culture goes to college just to find husbands, et cetera, et cetera. And there’s a reason why these women are the way that they are. And what’s interesting with that particular cast is most of them are young. They’re like 22, 23, some of them are divorced, most of them have children. The older ones in their 30s are still involved in this bullshit. Right. And the reality is they have this high school mentality and they never evolve from that, which is why it’s these constant cycles. And that is interesting to me and I think to myself, they are perpetuating that mentality always. Yet I’m so far removed from that And I never. That was never my mentality, ever. And so when you don’t evolve from that mentality, you’re always going to be stuck in that mentality, which is where you have that, oh, my God, my best friend’s gonna tell me this. So I’m going to value my best friend bullshit opinion more potentially than, you know, whatever. When reality is, my best friend should just be listening and asking the questions and really encouraging me to dig deep down and see what’s best for me, not influencing what I think, what you think onto me based on your opinion of my partner. It doesn’t matter if you like my partner or not.
Speaker A [00:28:14]: Right.
Speaker B [00:28:15]: You know, right.
Speaker A [00:28:16]: Something. This is what made me think of this. And what I’m hearing you say is emotional maturity. And I’m hearing you say eq. Yeah, right. Let’s not go there.
Speaker B [00:28:28]: You know who doesn’t have eq? The Mormon wives.
Speaker A [00:28:32]: Remember when Scott was like, eq? What’s eq? What does that mean? And we’re like, well, if you have to ask, you don’t have it. Remember? That’s what you said. Poor Scott. You’re a good guy, Scott. So this is what I was thinking when I was talking to Nina the other day. And she was sharing with me an experience that she was going through. And I had a wicked strong reaction to it. And my wicked strong reaction to it was out of protection and out of love and out of care and out of like, we need to look at this from all of the angles. This is what needs to happen in this situation. And you know how I get when I’m in that place is.
Speaker B [00:29:09]: What do you mean? I can’t possibly know what you mean.
Speaker A [00:29:11]: Right. Cause you don’t get it 24 7.
Speaker B [00:29:15]: I don’t possibly know what you mean.
Speaker A [00:29:16]: She referred to it as mama bear, Aaron. And I’m like, okay, that’s exactly what happens. It’s like I throw reckless abandon to everything else. And I’m like, we gotta fix this. Here’s what’s going on. Let me have a really strong. And you know, there’s no way I’m wrong about how I’m feeling about it too. Right? So I’m just like, real, real in the face. And then, unlike you and Nina, which I found out who have shame and guilt experience after that, I don’t feel any of you. They’re going to take that advice. Your life’s going to suck. That’s what’s going to happen. You’re welcome.
Speaker B [00:29:46]: I want to absolutely die. In fact, I still want to die, Scott. I still have shame and guilt for.
Speaker A [00:29:51]: The rest of my life. It’s so funny. But here’s what’s interesting. So Nina’s partner had a very normal reaction to that, which was, oh, I feel like maybe she’s mad about this decision. And. And Nina’s response just so beautifully was, no, she’s not mad at all. She just loves us so much that she wants to make sure whatever decision we make is going to be in our best interest. We’re gonna be safe, we’re gonna be comfortable. We’re gonna be okay. Whatever decision we make here is going to be fine. And in that moment, I was like, oh, my God, she sees me.
Speaker B [00:30:32]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:30:32]: Yeah, she sees me. And I said, I so appreciate that, you know, and that you can educate your partner on the fact that the minute you’ve created that bond, I am here for both of you.
Speaker B [00:30:46]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:30:47]: There is never a time where I am like, screw your partner because of what? You’re my friend. That’s not how I think at all. I’m like, we are in it, and I want you all to be okay. And here’s how I feel like we can help the situation or whatever. But that conversation led to a conversation about emotional maturity. And I said, nina, you have come so effing far in the last two years. Because I think previously, if your partner had said, oh, I think she’s really upset, you might have thought, oh, well, maybe she is upset, and maybe we did something wrong, and maybe I should do something different. Instead of caving to that and letting that be your influence. She stood on her own two feet and said, no, I know Erin. And she just loves us so fricking much. This is what her love looks like. And so it’s that level influence. Influence can have such a drastic level on what happens specifically when all parties are not able to stand on their own two feet, are not able to understand what emotional maturity in a relationship looks like. Right? And what she said at the end was beautiful. She said, here’s the thing. If we move forward with exactly what we think we’re gonna move forward for, no one is showing up stronger for us than Erin. She’s gonna show up and say, never is gonna say, see, I knew this was gonna be a shit show. Instead, she’s gonna say, great, let me come over. Let me figure out how to do this. Let’s figure out when it does become an issue, how we’re gonna work through that together. Right? But the impact of influence is just so big. And if we think about all of these outside forces that impact a relationship. My questions would be, who are the people that are impactful influencing your marriage? They don’t have to be direct. They can also be indirect, like your Mormon Wives of Vegas or whatever the hell you were talking about. Yeah, let’s get clear about what those people’s motivations are. Do you find those people to be able to take other people’s perspectives? Are they showing up for your partnership or are they showing up for you? And what does that look like? What does that mean?
Speaker B [00:33:00]: I think you need to have both. There needs to be support in both areas or the opposite. I do not want that. So what can I do to make sure I do not have that? Yeah, cuz that is not good.
Speaker A [00:33:14]: Yeah, right. You mean the friend saying that?
Speaker B [00:33:16]: No, just the, the, the, the, the whole thing.
Speaker A [00:33:19]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:33:20]: I don’t like what that looks like. Like that, that model, that relationship, that concept that that is, that does, that does not look healthy. I don’t want to be doing. I don’t want that relationship. So those things are not good.
Speaker C [00:33:32]: Yeah, that’s. That’ yeah, we see that all the time.
Speaker B [00:33:35]: We’re not doing.
Speaker C [00:33:36]: That dynamic is terrible.
Speaker B [00:33:37]: That. Stay away from that. Abort, Abort.
Speaker A [00:33:40]: Interesting.
Speaker C [00:33:42]: We’re not, you know, we’re not experts by any means, but I think we’ve, we’ve been through a lot and have come a long way. That when you see those similar things with other people, like you see, oh, they are where we were and this is what we did to get out of that. What are they doing? No, they’re actually getting worse. Their dynamic is getting worse. And it’s, and it’s kind of difficult to watch, especially if you really care about those people. Yeah, that’s hard to watch that happen. And to not. Some people insert themselves in other people’s relationships.
Speaker B [00:34:17]: Yes, they do.
Speaker C [00:34:18]: And just go, wow, you got to do this. We’re not really like that. And you know, it’s kind of like unsolicited advice.
Speaker B [00:34:27]: Never works.
Speaker C [00:34:28]: If they say, God, what should I do in this situation?
Speaker A [00:34:30]: Even if it is solicited, that doesn’t work either. Yeah, right. Even if. Yeah. When it is solicited. What you learn as a therapist is that when someone says, I don’t know, what would you do? They really don’t want to know what you would do. They just are looking for confirmation that they’re in an okay place. Correct. Right.
Speaker B [00:34:44]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:34:45]: And so related to that, what I would add is one thing I’ve learned in my own marriage journey is Every single person’s on their own journey and experience. And. And there are factors that keep people in marriages that defy all sense of logic.
Speaker B [00:35:07]: That’s right. That’s right.
Speaker A [00:35:08]: And it’s been beautiful for me, as a highly black and white logical person, to embrace that and to not just have such massively definitive logic. TABLE examples of if this happens, then this is what the outcome is supposed to be. It’s so much more messy than that. That’s right. Right. It’s so much more complex.
Speaker B [00:35:31]: That.
Speaker A [00:35:31]: And that influence that comes in has to have an essence of. I know absolutely nothing outside of what I’m being told in this moment, which is a snapshot in time.
Speaker B [00:35:44]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:35:45]: And if the outside influence does not have. That they have missed, or if they’ve overstated their role in this relationship because there’s a million other tiny moments, experiences, examples, reasons that are impacting whatever is going on in that moment.
Speaker B [00:36:05]: And what’s right for you is not right for me. And what’s right for me is not right for you. And where you take a stance, I may not take a stance. And even though, again, it comes back to the values and all of that stuff, and even though we’re best friends and you may not value what I value and where I draw the line, you may not draw the line, but that I. We have such a relationship in such a way that we look past those things and support each other and that kind of stuff, because you can’t be so hard and fast. You just can’t be. That’s not how life works. And if life did work that way, it’s very lonely. Very, very lonely and predictable. Right. And when you are so definitive, you’re eating crow all the time. All the time. Because when you make flat, blanket statements and then you find yourself in that situation and you’re like, wow, I am not making that decision.
Speaker A [00:37:02]: That’s right. That’s right. I can have all the excuses, rationale that I want to. And then the minute I’m there, I’m.
Speaker B [00:37:12]: Like, wow, not doing that.
Speaker A [00:37:14]: This feels different.
Speaker B [00:37:16]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:37:16]: You know? Yeah, absolutely right.
Speaker B [00:37:18]: And then all of a sudden, all that judgment and all that shame you put on those people that you did before, and now you’re in that place and you’re like, okay, now I get.
Speaker A [00:37:28]: And why? Because it made you feel good as the person giving the advice to have a nice clear cut, put in the box with a bow on it response. That’s right.
Speaker B [00:37:37]: And reality is, life is fucking messy.
Speaker A [00:37:40]: It is messy.
Speaker B [00:37:41]: Life is messy. And there’s if this, then that. If this, then that to everything. And I always tell you. What do I always say to you? I raise my kids. There is no right and wrong. There is no right and wrong wrong. Every decision has a consequence. I do not care. Every single decision.
Speaker A [00:37:59]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:37:59]: Good, bad or ugly, doesn’t freaking matter what it is. And you’re gonna have to deal with that.
Speaker A [00:38:06]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:38:06]: No matter what. And you just need to do what’s right for you and you need to be okay with it. And that’s just the way life is, man.
Speaker A [00:38:16]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:38:16]: Just the way it is. So.
Speaker A [00:38:18]: Yep. The good, the bad, the ugly. Who influences your marriage? I would leave you with that question. Who influences your marri marriage? And do. Have they earned that seat at the table? Are you being skeptical enough? Are you thinking enough about how they’re influencing? Do you like them there? Are they of value to being there? And what impact is that having on your marriage?
Speaker B [00:38:41]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:38:42]: In case you haven’t noticed, our More Love sort of sections for this season are broken down into a couple different segments. And so that is. Is we do like three or four episodes associated with a segment. And that segment really wraps up our relationships and marriage and all of that kind of stuff, which leads us beautifully into the next segment.
Speaker B [00:39:05]: I’m excited about it.
Speaker A [00:39:06]: Which is on friendships.
Speaker B [00:39:07]: Oh, the best kind.
Speaker A [00:39:08]: So we are about to in our next episode. Let me see here how we worded it. Navigating adult friendships is what we’re coming at you with next as we move into that part of the More Love podcast, season three. If you like us, please, like, subscribe. Follow us on YouTube, tell a friend about us, get the word out about all things More Love. And whoop, whoop. Hang on.
Speaker C [00:39:35]: Turn the page.
Speaker A [00:39:36]: Wait a minute.
Speaker C [00:39:36]: Turn the page.
Speaker A [00:39:37]: And until next time, keep feeling, keep questioning, and keep spreading more love.
Speaker C [00:39:49]: Sam.
Speaker B [00:00:09]: Oh, people say to me all the time.
Speaker A [00:00:10]: Okay. About you, Aaron. Yes. All right, Aaron. What else do you have to say? Aaron. But they’re really talking to their partners because they do not believe that their partner ever in a million years could have concocted anything that sounds at all like what they’re saying. Unless they were influenced by me. Like I’m some freaking cult leader or something.
Speaker B [00:00:29]: People say it to me all the time.
Speaker A [00:00:30]: Exactly.
Speaker B [00:00:31]: Including, I mean, everybody.
Speaker A [00:00:32]: Yeah. What? Okay, Erin.
Speaker B [00:00:34]: Yeah, all the time.
Speaker A [00:00:35]: Because you’re not capable of having your own thoughts and opinions. Like, you’re just so highly walking around influenced all of the time. Like, our whole conversations is not. Here’s your answer, Rebecca. And you go traipsing right back into your home, and you say this, that, and the other thing. I would never. I would never. But the thought that I’m that highly influential. Thank you. I guess, to people. We got a good one today.
Speaker B [00:01:17]: I know. I’m excited.
Speaker A [00:01:18]: Another good one.
Speaker B [00:01:19]: So we always have good ones.
Speaker A [00:01:20]: I know. Well, at least we think we do. I don’t know what everybody else thinks. I mean, to be honest, the Facebook page is growing and growing.
Speaker B [00:01:27]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:01:28]: I think yesterday I approved seven new people to be a part of our Facebook community, which is really awesome.
Speaker C [00:01:35]: Some of them were Russian. That was.
Speaker A [00:01:37]: No, they were not. So random. From people trying to just impact our SEO or whatever the heck they’re trying to do. Yeah. So real life. Seven real life people. So we must be talking about something somebody cares about, which is good. Oh, wow. You got to read all those comments.
Speaker B [00:01:53]: We’re not doing that. That’s a lot of reading. Okay, we’re going to keep going. Keep going.
Speaker A [00:01:57]: So our last session was on reframing your love story, and that was essentially, how do we need to look at our marriage, our partnerships, our relationship from a different perspective? And I think that was a good session, too.
Speaker B [00:02:12]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:02:13]: Last one, though. Let me frame this question for you.
Speaker B [00:02:15]: I’m excited.
Speaker A [00:02:16]: Who influences your marriage? I mean, who influences. Maybe the title should be who influences your marriage and why is it your best friend? I kind of like that. Oh, it’s that guy. All right, so that’s what we’re going to be diving into today. We’re going to be talking about the good, the bad, the ugly, about who influences your marriage, why they influence, and just some cautionary tales. If someone is influencing your marriage, just to be aware of and to be mindful of as you continue to move through. So join us today if that is a topic of interest to you.
Speaker B [00:02:49]: To me, yes.
Speaker A [00:02:51]: So, as always, the hippie voo. The hippie vu tarot.
Speaker B [00:02:57]: The hippie voo of the hippie vous.
Speaker A [00:02:58]: As a part of the More Love podcast will guide us in all of our future conversations for today’s session. So who is this man?
Speaker B [00:03:06]: As well you know, our new version.
Speaker A [00:03:09]: Okay.
Speaker B [00:03:09]: We’re doing it live.
Speaker A [00:03:10]: Yes.
Speaker B [00:03:11]: You know. Yeah, live on there.
Speaker A [00:03:12]: What she means by that is she shuffles the cards, and when one falls out, it’s the spirit.
Speaker B [00:03:17]: Instead of doing it during. During our prep, I’m doing it, you know, Right. Right on the show. So this is King Triton, okay? The King of the ocean. And it’s order. He’s sitting in his merman throne, and he is looking straight out with his.
Speaker A [00:03:35]: Can I see the card spear thing?
Speaker B [00:03:37]: His. What is that thing called? Wand?
Speaker A [00:03:39]: I don’t know.
Speaker C [00:03:39]: Trident.
Speaker B [00:03:40]: Trident, yes, trident. He’s the father figure.
Speaker A [00:03:43]: He’s got some great abs.
Speaker B [00:03:44]: I know, it’s kind of hot. So order. The King of the ocean is a symbol of order. So if chaos has ruled recently, know that order and balance will soon be restored. If any boundaries have been crossed, you will be able to reassert your territory. And for this reason, he reveals an end to the disputes. At home, you will soon be getting more organized. And at work, good leadership and management reign. As a person, the king is the ideal partner. Or he stands for a father figure or father. And he stands for a father or father figure. So it’s time to get your work, finances, or home in order and take control to protect your assets. You have the power. Very interesting.
Speaker A [00:04:22]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:04:22]: Very interesting. So focus, protection, wisdom, organization, authority, leadership, and boundaries. Wow, that’s so interesting based on what we’re going to talk about today.
Speaker A [00:04:31]: I know.
Speaker B [00:04:32]: Story of our life.
Speaker A [00:04:33]: So who influences your marriage? Scott, if you could come into the bubble, please.
Speaker B [00:04:38]: That’s all right, Scott.
Speaker A [00:04:39]: We are just going to do what we call a rift, where I’m going to say, who influences your marriage? This doesn’t have to be your marriage in particular, but let’s just brainstorm out loud all of the people or the influences that potentially have some say or even if it’s subliminal in your marriage.
Speaker B [00:04:58]: Okay.
Speaker A [00:04:59]: So ready, Scott? I’m going to start. Your neighbors. Ooh, Your neighbors. Your own parents. Go ahead, guys, Anytime you want to throw something out here, it’s totally fine. Oh, yeah.
Speaker B [00:05:16]: It’s like, for us personally, yes.
Speaker A [00:05:17]: Anyone. Yeah. Or anyone.
Speaker B [00:05:18]: For me, it’s the Real Housewives franchise.
Speaker A [00:05:21]: Okay. Yeah, Yep. Love that.
Speaker B [00:05:23]: For sure.
Speaker A [00:05:23]: Yeah. The Bachelor.
Speaker C [00:05:27]: Nobody influences my.
Speaker B [00:05:29]: Oh, oh, okay. Okay.
Speaker A [00:05:31]: This podcast does, Scott.
Speaker B [00:05:32]: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A [00:05:34]: Okay.
Speaker B [00:05:35]: The. The. The groups I work for.
Speaker A [00:05:40]: Yeah, right.
Speaker B [00:05:40]: Very much so.
Speaker A [00:05:41]: Yes, very much. Because you’re so embedded in a bunch of different communities that are very unique and different from the traditional, you know, middle class.
Speaker B [00:05:50]: Yes.
Speaker A [00:05:51]: Family life. Oh, yeah, That’s a good one.
Speaker B [00:05:53]: Yes. And we’re always dissecting marriages.
Speaker A [00:05:55]: Yeah, yeah, Yep. That’s a good one. I would say some of the relationships I’ve seen on Instagram. Oh, yeah, yeah. So a little social media influence there.
Speaker B [00:06:05]: My friends. Relationships.
Speaker A [00:06:07]: Yep. Yeah. My best friends.
Speaker B [00:06:10]: Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A [00:06:11]: For sure. Influence my marriage via the conversations that we have.
Speaker B [00:06:15]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:06:16]: On the regular. You. Yeah, you, you. I mean, see, Scott just left bubble. Just went. He’s like, I’m all set with this. I’m all done. I’m not going to be influenced.
Speaker C [00:06:26]: Kelly’s friends influence our relationship in a way that. Because all of her friends. I don’t even know if I should say this. Most of her friends are married to douchebags.
Speaker A [00:06:37]: Oh, okay.
Speaker B [00:06:38]: All right. Okay.
Speaker C [00:06:39]: And so she gets to revel in the fact that I am not a douchebag.
Speaker A [00:06:43]: Oh. So she gets. She has a positive influence because she gets to sit there.
Speaker C [00:06:47]: She gets that positive reinforcement like, n. Look how good I have it. As compared to.
Speaker A [00:06:51]: That’s interesting. Okay, that’s a good one.
Speaker B [00:06:53]: She gets to brag.
Speaker A [00:06:54]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:06:55]: Okay.
Speaker A [00:06:55]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:06:55]: All right.
Speaker A [00:06:56]: Yep. That’s a good one.
Speaker B [00:06:57]: All right.
Speaker A [00:06:58]: I like this. If anything else comes up, feel free to shoot it out. But I think what’s interesting about this is so many people, even people we don’t even know, are influencing our relationships on a consistent basis.
Speaker B [00:07:14]: Oh, I just thought of one.
Speaker A [00:07:16]: Who?
Speaker B [00:07:16]: The murder mysteries we watch.
Speaker A [00:07:18]: Oh. Oh, yeah. Oh. Oh, for sure.
Speaker B [00:07:21]: My favorite was that thing you sent me the other day of the woman who’s creating her own binder.
Speaker A [00:07:26]: Oh, my God.
Speaker B [00:07:27]: Of who was going to.
Speaker A [00:07:27]: Kelly on the street sent that to me. I pissed myself. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She had a binder.
Speaker C [00:07:34]: The people to look at.
Speaker A [00:07:35]: This video is hilarious, Scott. It’s like an entire binder full of, like, if I’m ever on Dateline, here’s some images I want them to use of me that are my best images. My favorite was when she was like, here’s some of my best friends who do this their best. Staring off into the distance pose Right. While life thinking while they’re thinking about my death over a glass of water, like, oh my God.
Speaker B [00:08:01]: And here is the worst picture of my husband because he’s the number one suspect.
Speaker A [00:08:04]: That’s right. That’s right.
Speaker C [00:08:07]: Anybody who knows who watches those shows knows that you don’t have antifreeze at your house.
Speaker A [00:08:14]: That’s right.
Speaker C [00:08:14]: And Succinyl Cola.
Speaker A [00:08:15]: And you do not use your own search bar to search things like how much antifreeze does it take off my husband?
Speaker C [00:08:23]: How do I kill my wife if not get caught.
Speaker A [00:08:25]: That’s right. That’s right. That’s a great. That’s a good one. That’s a really good one. That’s another influence. So we sure as shit know that all of these things are influencing us. But in this topic, I was really honing in on the best friendship relationship. And when you have very close people in your life, they certainly are the people you’re gonna go to that you’re gonna share all the down dirty details about. This is what’s working, what’s not working. Very rarely, even in our own relationship do I think we’re flocking to each other when things are so beaut wonderful that we are just like, oh my God, let me tell you this very sweet thing that just happened. I mean, it does happen, but it happens pales in comparison to when we’re pissed at our spouses or they did something that annoys us or whatever. Right. And so I think about this best friendship dynamic and I think about the relationships we have with people. And really, for real, what influence does it have when you run to your closest friends to talk about what’s working or not working in your partnership? And that’s what I’m hoping we can dive into a little bit today. To either of you have any examples about ways in which you’ve leaned into someone and it has had an impact on your marriage?
Speaker B [00:09:44]: Positive or negative?
Speaker A [00:09:45]: Yeah, either one. You too, Scott.
Speaker C [00:09:50]: Crickets. I really can’t think. I mean, the only thing that really had a real positive impact on my marriage was the marriage counseling. I mean, I can’t. I guess I’m boring in the fact that I don’t have very many friends that I go and hang out with all the time. And definitely I can’t think of it. Maybe one of my friends would be someone that I would look to for marriage advice. The rest of them, not so much.
Speaker B [00:10:24]: It’s funny you say that. I’m kind of tight lipped when it comes to sharing things, specifically when it comes to being vulnerable, number one. Number two, I Don’t really value a lot of advice from other people when I look at their lives, because what I’m watching them do is not something that I’m blown away by or admire. Therefore, they aren’t going to give me any advice that would matter. Because, frankly, actions speak louder than words. And therefore, the people that I’m inspired by or am going to be influenced by are. I don’t need to talk to. I just need to watch and take action by.
Speaker A [00:11:24]: Interesting.
Speaker B [00:11:24]: Does that make sense?
Speaker A [00:11:25]: Yes. And you’ve always been very selective about your.
Speaker B [00:11:27]: Very selective.
Speaker A [00:11:29]: Who’s in your inner circle, and then who are you going to be taking?
Speaker B [00:11:32]: Yes. And I’ll talk and I talk through. I talk through my own emotions and my own things because I learned very early on that I can’t change other people. I can only change me. So I talk through those things with you and then work through what I need to work through and then decide, is it worth it? And then once I do that, then I look to other examples on how to implement that. Does that make sense?
Speaker A [00:11:55]: Yes.
Speaker B [00:11:55]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:11:56]: Yeah. And I would say I’m completely dissimilar from the two of you. I would say I have four or five key people that I go to consistently as, like, sounding boards for all things.
Speaker B [00:12:11]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:12:12]: Yeah. Now, I might go to you each differently for different topics or a range of topics.
Speaker B [00:12:18]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:12:19]: But when I think about this a little deeper, maybe some of where this has come from was I’ve spent a great majority of my life just listening to other people and not feeling close to other people, because I would always wait for them to want to be interested in what was happening in my life, and that would never come. So I was just everyone’s counselor in my friend group for a very, very, very long time. Somewhere along the way, that shifted for me. And I thought, if you really want to have genuinely close relationships with people, you can’t just wait to be invited into those conversations. You have to offer something up. And so I would step very slowly into these relationships, and then I would. I would be like, do I like that? Do I not like that? Can you handle this? Can you not handle this? Right. I don’t think it was conscious always on my part, but. And then because of that, I really developed four to five beautifully close women friendships that I feel get me to my core and most importantly, I feel can be biased toward me, but not in hatred of my partner. Does that make sense? Yes, it is. They’re always gonna cheer me on. They’re always gonna want what’s best for me. They are willing to push back and say, I don’t know, let me just think about that from a different perspective. Or have you thought that maybe this is happening, but never. Have I surrounded myself, at least in this really small group with people who are like, here’s your answer. You just need to do this. There is no other option here and you need to call it a day. Or have I surrounded myself with people who are just so anti my partner that they can’t show me some of the goodness at the times where I’m most pissed or most upset about something?
Speaker B [00:14:27]: Well, I don’t think you would be able to hear that. And I don’t know if you would even be able to spend time around people who would say things to you like that. How could you possibly be around people who would say bad things about people you love? I couldn’t be.
Speaker A [00:14:43]: I think a lot of people, so long as they get validated in the feedback they’re getting from someone else, don’t care who it hurts, really.
Speaker B [00:14:55]: Maybe that’s why I’m so tight lipped, because I feel very strongly. I mean, you know how I go 0 to 100 if I am vulnerable for even a tiny little second and if somebody says one thing that’s off about somebody that I love? I can’t. I can’t. Right, Scott? Yeah, Right, Scott?
Speaker A [00:15:15]: Right.
Speaker B [00:15:15]: You like my texts?
Speaker C [00:15:16]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:15:19]: I forgot about that.
Speaker B [00:15:21]: I can’t. I really. I really struggle with that.
Speaker A [00:15:27]: You guys. That has to be an episode.
Speaker B [00:15:29]: I don’t.
Speaker A [00:15:30]: I have to talk about that again. Experience on a future episode. No, we did not.
Speaker B [00:15:35]: We did not.
Speaker A [00:15:36]: We have to talk about that. Coming up on the More Love podcast. The time where the podcast almost blew up.
Speaker C [00:15:43]: Oh, no, it did blow up.
Speaker A [00:15:44]: It blew up and then came back together. And then in the beautiful comfort of the.
Speaker B [00:15:50]: There almost was no season three. But that’s. But that’s how I am. Like, I. That’s why I don’t get vulnerable and I don’t allow that kind of thing to show because if I don’t go there, then I don’t have to go there. And then when I do go there, it’s very hard to come back because you can’t do things to the people that I love.
Speaker A [00:16:17]: Interesting.
Speaker B [00:16:18]: You just can’t.
Speaker A [00:16:18]: And the way I can relate with that is I don’t like to have to be on the defensive for someone that I’m mad at. So if I’m real pissed at Mark because he’s done something that I just can’t and then someone comes in with how much they can’t stand Mark or why what he’s doing is absolutely inappropriate and should be different. I feel like I have to protect him, to share the other side of the story. And then I’m pissed about that. I’m pissed that I have to. Why now? I have to be like, no, I know I hate him right now. He’s pissed me off, but he’s not a terrible human, and here’s why. And now I’m pissed that I have to even support him in this conversation. I just want to be mad at him. I don’t want you to also jump on board with hating him. Right. Exactly. At the same time, because I’m the one who gets to hate him right now. You just have to sit there and hate me. Like. Like just hating him. Right. Because I might get over it.
Speaker B [00:17:12]: No, you will get over it.
Speaker A [00:17:13]: Like, right.
Speaker C [00:17:14]: I just need something to vent to.
Speaker A [00:17:16]: Right.
Speaker C [00:17:16]: Just someone.
Speaker A [00:17:17]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:17:18]: Right.
Speaker A [00:17:18]: But this level of influence is so fascinating and so important. You’ve seen on these reality TV shows where these best friends will come in. You know, this is also real life. These best friends come in and they are the end all. Be all of the deciding fact of what’s going on in that relationship. That’s right. They are the person that you run to. They are the person that you kibits with. They are the person that ultimately, what they say holds way more weight than it does in your own relationship. In some cases, what they say matters more than how you feel about it. Because I think people just surrender themselves to saying, I just don’t have an answer. But Rebecca knows me better than anyone, and so I’m just gonna trust what she has to say in this. Right? Right. And so sort of trying to figure out what is healthy delegation of a conversation versus what is emotional avoidance of you managing it yourself is really fricking hard.
Speaker B [00:18:17]: Oh, yeah? Yeah.
Speaker A [00:18:18]: And then I can’t from a psychological perspective also not think, what is the motivation on the part of the listener, on the part of the best friend of the neighbor, of whomever. Right. Because if that is not in check, it’s like a therapist who’s gone rogue, you know? So, like, you’re trained as a therapist to recognize where your own counter transference or transference may be coming in experiences you’ve had in your own past life that are gonna trigger someone else. For instance, if I’m a therapist and I’m divorced and I’m a couples therapist and I’m meeting with a couple and Something that the husband did was something that my husband did that triggered my divorce. I am apt psychologically to encourage a divorce in that situation for a multitude of different reasons. You trained the therapist to recognize that and then not go there because that’s not your job. Friends aren’t trained like that. So let’s say one of your friends in a miserable marriage hates their marriage so much misery, loves company.
Speaker B [00:19:26]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:19:27]: Right. I know. And then let’s say that I just think from the partner’s perspective. If I think about Mark and Philip, they really have to be real on board with the fact that you and I are so close that Philip has to keep me close, and Mark needs to keep you close because of the level of influence that can exist there if we are unchecked.
Speaker B [00:19:54]: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A [00:19:55]: Unreal levels of influence.
Speaker B [00:19:58]: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A [00:19:59]: Thank God we’re perfect. We don’t have this problem.
Speaker B [00:20:00]: I know, but.
Speaker A [00:20:03]: But really, when you think about the potential unhealthy boundaries that can exist in a lot of these relationships.
Speaker B [00:20:10]: Oh, oh, and the. And the potential for threat. The potential for. If you come out of nowhere in Mark’s perception, and he could 100% be like, oh, what were you talking about, Rebecca?
Speaker A [00:20:24]: Oh, my God.
Speaker B [00:20:24]: Oh, what were you. Oh, oh.
Speaker A [00:20:26]: You know, this happens in my life. A ridiculous.
Speaker B [00:20:31]: People say that to you?
Speaker A [00:20:33]: No, no, not about the opposite. I swear to God, I can name for you 10 people off the top of my head that say to me. Tell me that their partners have said, okay, Aaron.
Speaker B [00:20:46]: Oh, people say to me all the time.
Speaker A [00:20:47]: Okay, about you, Aaron. Yes. All right, Aaron. What else do you have to say? Aaron. But they’re really talking to their partners because they do not believe that their partner ever in a million years could have concocted. Concocted anything that sounds at all like what they’re saying unless they were influenced by me. Like I’m some freaking cult leader or something.
Speaker B [00:21:06]: People say it to me all the time, Including, I mean, everybody.
Speaker A [00:21:09]: Yeah. What? Okay, Aaron.
Speaker B [00:21:11]: Yeah, all the time.
Speaker A [00:21:13]: Because you’re not capable of having your own thoughts and opinions. Like, you’re just so highly walking around influenced all of the time. And what’s most fascinating to me is a majority of our conversations is me asking you questions.
Speaker B [00:21:25]: Oh, yeah.
Speaker A [00:21:25]: Tell me more about that. Well, what do you think about that? I do have some thoughts on that. Do you think that this is related? Like, our whole conversations is not. Here’s your answer, Rebecca. And you go traipsing right back into your home, and you say this, that, and the other thing I wouldn’t. I would never. I would never. But the thought that I’m that highly influential. Thank you. I guess, to people.
Speaker B [00:21:47]: My entire training in my education has been to ask thoughtful questions. I’m a teacher. I’m a. I’m a. What is that?
Speaker A [00:21:58]: I teach.
Speaker B [00:21:58]: No, I teach the health educator. Yes. And I taught seminars and leadership workshops for 20 years to students. That’s my MO. That’s what I do. Right.
Speaker A [00:22:10]: So. Oh, my God, I’ve heard it so much from people who will come to me and say, well, I was telling them this. This. And I was going through what we talked about, and all I got was, okay, Erin.
Speaker B [00:22:22]: Yeah, I know.
Speaker A [00:22:23]: Apparently I’m just alive and well in everyone’s relationships. You know, it’s really fascinating.
Speaker B [00:22:29]: Well, it’s because I’m known for being the ditzy, dumb, psycho person. So when I come. So when I do talk in quote, unquote, therapeutic terms.
Speaker A [00:22:39]: Yes. Right.
Speaker B [00:22:40]: That’s when I become Aaron the therapist, because I’m not capable of having an intelligent conversation because I am the ditzy, dumb blonde that can’t possibly be intelligent. So the minute I become that.
Speaker A [00:22:58]: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker B [00:22:59]: I must have been. Yeah.
Speaker A [00:23:01]: It’s so starkly influenced.
Speaker B [00:23:03]: Yes.
Speaker A [00:23:03]: The other time I see it come up is when the partner asserts their rights.
Speaker B [00:23:08]: Oh. Yeah.
Speaker A [00:23:08]: So when the partner says, this is inappropriate and we shouldn’t be doing this anymore. Okay, Aaron. So, I mean, I really thank you, everybody. I just like to take a moment that the times where people feel you’ve been influenced are when you’re fighting for your own rights in your relationship or when you say something intelligent or therapeutic, or when you actually take the conversation a little bit more than just surface level bullshit and decide that we want to impact people’s experiences. Those are all Aaronisms, apparently. Awesome. That’s awesome. I can think of a whole lot of other things that I would not want my name associated with, but if that’s the case, great. Right.
Speaker B [00:23:45]: It’s really interesting. So that begs the question, are you a threat?
Speaker A [00:23:53]: Interesting.
Speaker B [00:23:53]: And I would say yes. I would say. I would say no.
Speaker A [00:23:57]: Honestly, that’s a fascinating question.
Speaker B [00:24:00]: I would ask those partners. I would ask those partners, if they were to be completely honest, those people would not want their partners going to you to have conversations.
Speaker A [00:24:10]: Right? That’s right. And I become a threat because I think part of my style of questioning is making people think differently about their experience. Sure. And in addition to that, really get clear on who they are and what they want.
Speaker B [00:24:26]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:24:26]: And those are things I don’t think come in many natural, normal conversations. So it really is that person just asserting. I have some more clarity now, but that’s very threatening. Of course it is. To a dynamic in a relationship that has either been allowed to be dysfunctional or has been uncomfortable or in a different power dynamic. That’s all it is than it has.
Speaker B [00:24:50]: Exactly.
Speaker A [00:24:51]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:24:51]: It’s real.
Speaker A [00:24:52]: Really? That’s really interesting.
Speaker B [00:24:53]: Exactly. And my husband’s just been. He’s been around from the beginning, so.
Speaker A [00:24:57]: He’S just used to it. He just knows his role. He just used Toast is wrong. Yeah, but so from a partner’s perspective, I think it’s interesting if the other person, let’s say the best friend on the other side of the coin, is impartial and has the best interest of the relationship at heart. I think that that serves as a really beautiful opportunity to reflect and to refocus on that relationship. If however, the partner, the best friend, is very one sided and is biased and does not like the, let’s say, husband in this case, then I do think that is a threat. I do think that it becomes a situation where every time you run to me to talk about something, if your husband doesn’t trust that I’m coming from a place of peace and fairness, he’s not gonna love that relationship. Right. And the question begs for me, is that a partner problem or is that a best friend problem?
Speaker B [00:26:02]: That’s a great question.
Speaker A [00:26:04]: You know, whose problem is that?
Speaker B [00:26:11]: That’s a really good question. I just keep going back to the fact that the Secret Life of Mormons Wives just came out.
Speaker A [00:26:17]: Sure did. I started watching it and I had to stop. It was too much for me.
Speaker B [00:26:21]: Okay, well, I was listening to the Sirius XM radio station with Andy Cohen because I love Bravo and all that shit. And they were talking about specifically Mormons in Utah and how the phenomenon with Mormon women and how typically that culture goes to college just to find husbands, et cetera, et cetera. And there’s a reason why these women are the way that they are. And what’s interesting with that particular cast is most of them are young. They’re like 22, 23, some of them are divorced, most of them have children. The older ones in their 30s are still involved in this bullshit. Right. And the reality is they have this high school mentality and they never evolve from that, which is why it’s these constant cycles. And that is interesting to me and I think to myself, they are perpetuating that mentality always. Yet I’m so far removed from that And I never. That was never my mentality, ever. And so when you don’t evolve from that mentality, you’re always going to be stuck in that mentality, which is where you have that, oh, my God, my best friend’s gonna tell me this. So I’m going to value my best friend bullshit opinion more potentially than, you know, whatever. When reality is, my best friend should just be listening and asking the questions and really encouraging me to dig deep down and see what’s best for me, not influencing what I think, what you think onto me based on your opinion of my partner. It doesn’t matter if you like my partner or not.
Speaker A [00:28:14]: Right.
Speaker B [00:28:15]: You know, right.
Speaker A [00:28:16]: Something. This is what made me think of this. And what I’m hearing you say is emotional maturity. And I’m hearing you say eq. Yeah, right. Let’s not go there.
Speaker B [00:28:28]: You know who doesn’t have eq? The Mormon wives.
Speaker A [00:28:32]: Remember when Scott was like, eq? What’s eq? What does that mean? And we’re like, well, if you have to ask, you don’t have it. Remember? That’s what you said. Poor Scott. You’re a good guy, Scott. So this is what I was thinking when I was talking to Nina the other day. And she was sharing with me an experience that she was going through. And I had a wicked strong reaction to it. And my wicked strong reaction to it was out of protection and out of love and out of care and out of like, we need to look at this from all of the angles. This is what needs to happen in this situation. And you know how I get when I’m in that place is.
Speaker B [00:29:09]: What do you mean? I can’t possibly know what you mean.
Speaker A [00:29:11]: Right. Cause you don’t get it 24 7.
Speaker B [00:29:15]: I don’t possibly know what you mean.
Speaker A [00:29:16]: She referred to it as mama bear, Aaron. And I’m like, okay, that’s exactly what happens. It’s like I throw reckless abandon to everything else. And I’m like, we gotta fix this. Here’s what’s going on. Let me have a really strong. And you know, there’s no way I’m wrong about how I’m feeling about it too. Right? So I’m just like, real, real in the face. And then, unlike you and Nina, which I found out who have shame and guilt experience after that, I don’t feel any of you. They’re going to take that advice. Your life’s going to suck. That’s what’s going to happen. You’re welcome.
Speaker B [00:29:46]: I want to absolutely die. In fact, I still want to die, Scott. I still have shame and guilt for.
Speaker A [00:29:51]: The rest of my life. It’s so funny. But here’s what’s interesting. So Nina’s partner had a very normal reaction to that, which was, oh, I feel like maybe she’s mad about this decision. And. And Nina’s response just so beautifully was, no, she’s not mad at all. She just loves us so much that she wants to make sure whatever decision we make is going to be in our best interest. We’re gonna be safe, we’re gonna be comfortable. We’re gonna be okay. Whatever decision we make here is going to be fine. And in that moment, I was like, oh, my God, she sees me.
Speaker B [00:30:32]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:30:32]: Yeah, she sees me. And I said, I so appreciate that, you know, and that you can educate your partner on the fact that the minute you’ve created that bond, I am here for both of you.
Speaker B [00:30:46]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:30:47]: There is never a time where I am like, screw your partner because of what? You’re my friend. That’s not how I think at all. I’m like, we are in it, and I want you all to be okay. And here’s how I feel like we can help the situation or whatever. But that conversation led to a conversation about emotional maturity. And I said, nina, you have come so effing far in the last two years. Because I think previously, if your partner had said, oh, I think she’s really upset, you might have thought, oh, well, maybe she is upset, and maybe we did something wrong, and maybe I should do something different. Instead of caving to that and letting that be your influence. She stood on her own two feet and said, no, I know Erin. And she just loves us so fricking much. This is what her love looks like. And so it’s that level influence. Influence can have such a drastic level on what happens specifically when all parties are not able to stand on their own two feet, are not able to understand what emotional maturity in a relationship looks like. Right? And what she said at the end was beautiful. She said, here’s the thing. If we move forward with exactly what we think we’re gonna move forward for, no one is showing up stronger for us than Erin. She’s gonna show up and say, never is gonna say, see, I knew this was gonna be a shit show. Instead, she’s gonna say, great, let me come over. Let me figure out how to do this. Let’s figure out when it does become an issue, how we’re gonna work through that together. Right? But the impact of influence is just so big. And if we think about all of these outside forces that impact a relationship. My questions would be, who are the people that are impactful influencing your marriage? They don’t have to be direct. They can also be indirect, like your Mormon Wives of Vegas or whatever the hell you were talking about. Yeah, let’s get clear about what those people’s motivations are. Do you find those people to be able to take other people’s perspectives? Are they showing up for your partnership or are they showing up for you? And what does that look like? What does that mean?
Speaker B [00:33:00]: I think you need to have both. There needs to be support in both areas or the opposite. I do not want that. So what can I do to make sure I do not have that? Yeah, cuz that is not good.
Speaker A [00:33:14]: Yeah, right. You mean the friend saying that?
Speaker B [00:33:16]: No, just the, the, the, the, the whole thing.
Speaker A [00:33:19]: Yeah.
Speaker B [00:33:20]: I don’t like what that looks like. Like that, that model, that relationship, that concept that that is, that does, that does not look healthy. I don’t want to be doing. I don’t want that relationship. So those things are not good.
Speaker C [00:33:32]: Yeah, that’s. That’ yeah, we see that all the time.
Speaker B [00:33:35]: We’re not doing.
Speaker C [00:33:36]: That dynamic is terrible.
Speaker B [00:33:37]: That. Stay away from that. Abort, Abort.
Speaker A [00:33:40]: Interesting.
Speaker C [00:33:42]: We’re not, you know, we’re not experts by any means, but I think we’ve, we’ve been through a lot and have come a long way. That when you see those similar things with other people, like you see, oh, they are where we were and this is what we did to get out of that. What are they doing? No, they’re actually getting worse. Their dynamic is getting worse. And it’s, and it’s kind of difficult to watch, especially if you really care about those people. Yeah, that’s hard to watch that happen. And to not. Some people insert themselves in other people’s relationships.
Speaker B [00:34:17]: Yes, they do.
Speaker C [00:34:18]: And just go, wow, you got to do this. We’re not really like that. And you know, it’s kind of like unsolicited advice.
Speaker B [00:34:27]: Never works.
Speaker C [00:34:28]: If they say, God, what should I do in this situation?
Speaker A [00:34:30]: Even if it is solicited, that doesn’t work either. Yeah, right. Even if. Yeah. When it is solicited. What you learn as a therapist is that when someone says, I don’t know, what would you do? They really don’t want to know what you would do. They just are looking for confirmation that they’re in an okay place. Correct. Right.
Speaker B [00:34:44]: Yeah.
Speaker A [00:34:45]: And so related to that, what I would add is one thing I’ve learned in my own marriage journey is Every single person’s on their own journey and experience. And. And there are factors that keep people in marriages that defy all sense of logic.
Speaker B [00:35:07]: That’s right. That’s right.
Speaker A [00:35:08]: And it’s been beautiful for me, as a highly black and white logical person, to embrace that and to not just have such massively definitive logic. TABLE examples of if this happens, then this is what the outcome is supposed to be. It’s so much more messy than that. That’s right. Right. It’s so much more complex.
Speaker B [00:35:31]: That.
Speaker A [00:35:31]: And that influence that comes in has to have an essence of. I know absolutely nothing outside of what I’m being told in this moment, which is a snapshot in time.
Speaker B [00:35:44]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:35:45]: And if the outside influence does not have. That they have missed, or if they’ve overstated their role in this relationship because there’s a million other tiny moments, experiences, examples, reasons that are impacting whatever is going on in that moment.
Speaker B [00:36:05]: And what’s right for you is not right for me. And what’s right for me is not right for you. And where you take a stance, I may not take a stance. And even though, again, it comes back to the values and all of that stuff, and even though we’re best friends and you may not value what I value and where I draw the line, you may not draw the line, but that I. We have such a relationship in such a way that we look past those things and support each other and that kind of stuff, because you can’t be so hard and fast. You just can’t be. That’s not how life works. And if life did work that way, it’s very lonely. Very, very lonely and predictable. Right. And when you are so definitive, you’re eating crow all the time. All the time. Because when you make flat, blanket statements and then you find yourself in that situation and you’re like, wow, I am not making that decision.
Speaker A [00:37:02]: That’s right. That’s right. I can have all the excuses, rationale that I want to. And then the minute I’m there, I’m.
Speaker B [00:37:12]: Like, wow, not doing that.
Speaker A [00:37:14]: This feels different.
Speaker B [00:37:16]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:37:16]: You know? Yeah, absolutely right.
Speaker B [00:37:18]: And then all of a sudden, all that judgment and all that shame you put on those people that you did before, and now you’re in that place and you’re like, okay, now I get.
Speaker A [00:37:28]: And why? Because it made you feel good as the person giving the advice to have a nice clear cut, put in the box with a bow on it response. That’s right.
Speaker B [00:37:37]: And reality is, life is fucking messy.
Speaker A [00:37:40]: It is messy.
Speaker B [00:37:41]: Life is messy. And there’s if this, then that. If this, then that to everything. And I always tell you. What do I always say to you? I raise my kids. There is no right and wrong. There is no right and wrong wrong. Every decision has a consequence. I do not care. Every single decision.
Speaker A [00:37:59]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:37:59]: Good, bad or ugly, doesn’t freaking matter what it is. And you’re gonna have to deal with that.
Speaker A [00:38:06]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:38:06]: No matter what. And you just need to do what’s right for you and you need to be okay with it. And that’s just the way life is, man.
Speaker A [00:38:16]: Yep.
Speaker B [00:38:16]: Just the way it is. So.
Speaker A [00:38:18]: Yep. The good, the bad, the ugly. Who influences your marriage? I would leave you with that question. Who influences your marri marriage? And do. Have they earned that seat at the table? Are you being skeptical enough? Are you thinking enough about how they’re influencing? Do you like them there? Are they of value to being there? And what impact is that having on your marriage?
Speaker B [00:38:41]: That’s right.
Speaker A [00:38:42]: In case you haven’t noticed, our More Love sort of sections for this season are broken down into a couple different segments. And so that is. Is we do like three or four episodes associated with a segment. And that segment really wraps up our relationships and marriage and all of that kind of stuff, which leads us beautifully into the next segment.
Speaker B [00:39:05]: I’m excited about it.
Speaker A [00:39:06]: Which is on friendships.
Speaker B [00:39:07]: Oh, the best kind.
Speaker A [00:39:08]: So we are about to in our next episode. Let me see here how we worded it. Navigating adult friendships is what we’re coming at you with next as we move into that part of the More Love podcast, season three. If you like us, please, like, subscribe. Follow us on YouTube, tell a friend about us, get the word out about all things More Love. And whoop, whoop. Hang on.
Speaker C [00:39:35]: Turn the page.
Speaker A [00:39:36]: Wait a minute.
Speaker C [00:39:36]: Turn the page.
Speaker A [00:39:37]: And until next time, keep feeling, keep questioning, and keep spreading more love.
Speaker C [00:39:49]: Sam.
