“I see cooch” Scott says in surprise as Erin sends him a picture that she randomly sent to Rebecca in the wee hours of the morning. Erin’s empathy is in overload as she tries to understand whether the person who posted made the intentional choice to expose it all or if she’s the victim of a hacker. Then Scott’s off-the-cuff empathy problem twists the conversation in all sorts of new directions about generational advice, the parental connection, approval and leaves us asking you the question, “Can you relate with Scott’s empathy problem? How so?”
00;00;00;00 – 00;00;31;10
Unknown
Hey, it’s me Erin Thanks for joining us on the Moor Love podcast. Do not tell Rebecca, but this podcast is about empathy. She likes people to think she’s dead inside. But the truth is, she’s a big time feeler who has truly helped me uncover that empathy is my superpower. Here she comes. Hey, bestie. Hi, love. What are you doing?
00;00;31;11 – 00;00;56;11
Unknown
Oh, just getting ready to host a podcast. A podcast about what? Our life. Our life is. Best friends who are more like sisters. Yay! I love us, and I can’t wait to share stories of the world, especially the ones that involve us pushing each other right to be our most authentic selves. Wow, man. Okay.
00;00;56;13 – 00;01;18;05
Unknown
What? I just gotta open the oil. Yeah, and I’m like, what’s wrong with it? It’s all leaked out onto the cardboard. Oh, the smell it. Oh, my God, it smells so good. It doesn’t. Look at what happened. How come the top side of it, which would shock Royal, is that this is the solar plexus. Look at the belly button when it’s gone.
00;01;18;27 – 00;01;38;12
Unknown
You’re smiling. Yeah. Let’s just take the box and wipe it on your boob. Oh that’s not so bad. It’s like lemon pledge. Well. Oh so we’re plexus. More lemon please. Yes, I have it. That’s not it. Thank you. So much for putting that on your neck. I really appreciate that. It only took about two, so I to throw this away.
00;01;38;13 – 00;01;46;06
Unknown
Yeah. It’s gone. But then I will have a complete set.
00;01;46;08 – 00;02;02;24
Unknown
I have so many thoughts and feelings right now. I gotta throw it away. I’m like, I was wondering why my car is smelling really good. Why would we keep. It was my first thought. My next thought was okay. I mean, it’s important to her. So give it a minute and then I’m like, it’s an empty bottle. I know I’m not a hoarder.
00;02;02;24 – 00;02;22;17
Unknown
And you’re not going to keep the that thing you’re about to throw away. So I’m sorry, I that is an example of a time where I came to a conclusion quicker than you did. So maybe one example is just one. But I forgot about my, my cards today. Okay. Having the cards? No, no, no. Getting them out.
00;02;22;20 – 00;02;41;06
Unknown
Oh, why don’t you tell Scott what I sent you a picture of? Oh, my God, this morning. So she sends me a text message, and it’s just a, you know, an attachment, which is not unusual. In fact, Scott, you got your phone? Yeah, as a matter of fact, I do. Okay. Then I don’t want to tell, because. This will let me just send you a little ditty here.
00;02;41;12 – 00;03;06;12
Unknown
I want Scott’s reaction. Okay. Let’s see. It’s. What time was it that I sent this to you? 825. Okay. It’s not the first thing in your camera roll. Yeah. It is. I just had to pull up Scott’s phone number. Oh, okay. Sorry, Scott. Just look at the whole picture. Oh, what do you say? What do you mean? What do you see in the stories?
00;03;06;14 – 00;03;27;19
Unknown
Oh, yeah. What do you see, Scott? Who do you see? I see coach. Listen, we have to talk about this. This is. This is not okay. So this is it. I go, oh, that’s a vagina. That’s what I thought I was. Harry. Vagina. I’m thinking it’s one of those tricks where it’s actually, like, somebody’s neck, but for some reason.
00;03;27;24 – 00;03;49;03
Unknown
Oh. That’s funny. A vagina. This person is really funny. Listen, don’t say the name out loud. Okay? Listen. I don’t even know who that is. That lady. That. No, no, this is the one I have to talk to you about that. Okay? Because the profile picture doesn’t match the story. I can’t believe you just said that. And I can’t wait to talk about that, too.
00;03;49;09 – 00;04;23;19
Unknown
All right. Listen. Lay it on me. This is a girl that I went to high school with. Incessantly bullied. When I say she’s all right. When I. Yes, she’s. She’s Irish. Yes. When I say bullied, I mean incredibly, an incredible story of someone who persevered through people being. She was the the person that people would choose as the butt of their jokes every single time.
00;04;23;21 – 00;04;53;17
Unknown
Except for me. I know I am the one. Who would say hi to her in the hall? I am the one who would go over to her locker. I am the one who would see her sitting alone and lunch. Right? Because when you talk about empathy is just this ingrained piece I felt constantly. Every time I saw her, just this incredible sense of sadness for her.
00;04;53;20 – 00;05;17;07
Unknown
So Facebook becomes a thing. And she friends me on Facebook. 100% accept it. I have never had any conversations with her since, right. But I have seen some of her. I mean, this is when we were in college. Posted. Yeah. Okay. So that long ago this was like not weeks ago. And we’ve been friends from the beginning on Facebook.
00;05;17;14 – 00;05;40;01
Unknown
Okay. Yeah. And, the other day I go in and open up Facebook, and that is still to this moment. The the first thing what I just sent to you and Scott is the first thing that pops up. You got the word Facebook on the top. You got the Facebook stories and then you got, like, everyone s feed comments on there.
00;05;40;04 – 00;06;10;15
Unknown
So I see in this story this hairy vagina and I’m perplexed because it’s next to this woman’s name. So I when I’m telling you that every single feeling is going through me right now, I’m thinking to myself, this is what’s going on. Okay, I’m going to walk you through this. Well, maybe maybe she has a new job. Maybe what?
00;06;10;17 – 00;06;33;09
Unknown
This is part of OnlyFans. Maybe she really turned a new leaf. Well, there’s no way that that’s her vagina. Why would I? That’s why I’m saying it didn’t match. Why would I think that wasn’t her vagina? Why would I be judging people’s vaginas? That’s a lot of hair. Why is the underwear pulled off a little bit to the side?
00;06;33;15 – 00;06;56;13
Unknown
That looks like a vagina wedgie. This is what is going on for me. I’d like you to know that the tone I just read that in was like, really? It’s only been really good. I ate Asmr, so, what do I do? I screenshot it and I send it to Mark. Okay. Now, Mark knows her because we went to high school together.
00;06;57;23 – 00;07;22;20
Unknown
What’s his first comment? That’s not her badge okay. Okay. So what do I do? I send it to Becky Boyle. Also went to high school. What’s her first comment. That’s not her fancy. Wasn’t I, I then call Nina and I say I gotta tell you this thing happen and I got to send you this picture.
00;07;22;21 – 00;07;47;21
Unknown
I send the picture to her. She goes oh God, what the heck is going on? The questions that keep coming up, why did that not get taken down from Facebook yet? Why is that still on her stories? Is that really her vagina? Probably not. So did she get scammed? Like T had to. Hacked. Taken over by by bots?
00;07;47;26 – 00;08;12;03
Unknown
Well, if she did, then I’m thinking, oh my gosh, I have to contact her. I need to contact her. And I need to be the one to say, I don’t know if you know this, but there’s a picture of legs with a very hairy vag on your stories, and I don’t want that for you. If you don’t want that for you.
00;08;12;05 – 00;08;33;13
Unknown
She goes, I want that for you. You don’t want that for you. If you don’t want that for you. If you want that for you, that’s great. can I ask that we maybe take that off of Facebook? Maybe not the place. Right? Like, I mean, just use this as an opportunity to talk about appropriateness. So then I send it to Rebecca this morning at 830 in the morning.
00;08;33;13 – 00;08;56;10
Unknown
And what did you say? I said, oh, my God, that’s a fat. And then what did you say? I said, it’s a kind of a nice image. I gotta tell you, I mean, if you’re going have a hairy badge, I mean, I guess it’s a hairy badge. That’s nice. I don’t know. It is the the white underwear that looks like cotton candy thongs.
00;08;56;11 – 00;09;16;07
Unknown
Oh, yeah. Pulled off to the side. I don’t understand. Which pushes the push part. Makes me highly uncomfortable. The whole thing is uncomfortable. How? That’s not something you should see in a story. How about every time you open up your Facebook page? That’s. That’s the first thing that’s popping up. Wynona’s Harry Beaver looking right at you. Like, no, I’m not.
00;09;16;10 – 00;09;36;25
Unknown
That’s right. Oh, why? But why? Don’t know. How did you contact her? No, I haven’t yet. Should I? I will just report it just for you. I can’t, she’s she’s a victim of bullying. What if she really wants that picture? I can’t, I’m not going to be the one. You know, if that. If that’s her taking some of her power back.
00;09;36;25 – 00;09;53;27
Unknown
More power to her. Because I’m not. I can’t ignore it. You want to take it? You want to ignore it? How often do you go on Facebook? Every single day. No. What I do is I. I will either, because I’ve had some people that I follow that have put up some kind of not things that I don’t particularly care for.
00;09;54;00 – 00;10;13;03
Unknown
And so I will either mute their alerts or mute their whatever their story, you can mute a story, I think, or I will just unfollow them if I don’t want to take the drastic step of unfriending them. Like, I don’t like what that is, so I’m going to unfollow them. So now I don’t see that anymore so they can do it all they want, but I don’t see it.
00;10;13;04 – 00;10;36;28
Unknown
Right. But it’s the empathy component that she’s feeling like this girl doesn’t know I. She might. You have to write like set maybe shaved white horse and shave her shaved white or oh my god right. I’m assuming I took a wild guess. I, just based on her talking about that. I mean, that’s fun. Assumed you guys were cool.
00;10;36;28 – 00;11;02;10
Unknown
That’s a fun game. You shaved, waxed or bush? Wait. I’d say wait a minute, wait a minute. Do you not remember? Do you not remember going with us to the waxer place? Yes I do. Okay. So then you know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We don’t we don’t know about you, right? Because. Oh, me went in there for the first time at the age of 42 and had your eyebrows waxed for the first time ever, which I’ve never done again and never will.
00;11;02;13 – 00;11;26;13
Unknown
This is exactly. We’re still the same exact place that we were in your unitard. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God. So anyway, that’s that’s what we call empathy for Facebook stories, veg additions, vegetable patch additions. Nice. And it’s not it’s not great, but I think I need to say something about it because if she doesn’t know, she needs to.
00;11;26;13 – 00;11;55;08
Unknown
If she does know, I want to really embrace that for her and then unfollow it and, definitely unfollow. But I’m telling you, every time I go to open my Facebook app, it’s there. It’s it’s why your stories don’t just even change. It does not change. It keeps showing up over and over and over again. It’s fascinating the fact that so many people have been like, that’s not her fans who watch it.
00;11;55;10 – 00;12;11;01
Unknown
Well, I mean, that was like the second thing I said. I know there’s a. You don’t even know her, right? Oh, I didn’t even look at the picture of the I didn’t even look at the who’s. That’s my second thing. The first thing is wow. And then the second thing is, all right, who’s posting this? That’s funny. I didn’t even I didn’t even look at that.
00;12;11;01 – 00;12;32;01
Unknown
I just looked at the back. Better understand the situation. Now, let me delete this from my phone. So my mom, my mom, my mom, my mom doesn’t go through my my mom. No. So the reason why I said that is because, remember you texted me yesterday? Oh. Empathy problem. Yeah. I have an empathy problem that that is about my mom.
00;12;32;01 – 00;12;49;10
Unknown
So that’s. Oh. Oh, should we dive right in? Yeah. It is. I know it, and perhaps I don’t know. Oh. That’s funny. My mom, my son, my mom doesn’t see it, so my mom doesn’t see the picture that you sent me. Yeah. Oh my God. I get I’m going to go out on a limb here, but I think if Kelly saw that, she’d be like, more power to you, Scott.
00;12;49;10 – 00;13;13;07
Unknown
If that’s the way we’re headed, you know, God limb, go for you. The limb and fell to your death. Yeah, right. So. Yeah. not not a soft landing at all. I love that I’m like Mark, like that. Look at this. Check this out a little. Little bit. You know, I, I didn’t realize, but I married a nun who is not religious, is not a religious nun.
00;13;13;08 – 00;13;32;16
Unknown
Oh, she just doesn’t like. Oh, she doesn’t like her. She gets very uncomfortable with with things of of that nature. Oh, okay. Specifically because she doesn’t want you involved in the business of other women or any type of topic. Like, even right now, she’d be dying that we’re talking about this in the podcast. Yeah. She’d be like, oh, okay.
00;13;32;17 – 00;13;56;16
Unknown
Oh, she’d go, no, no, no, no. Love that. All right. We are going to dive into Scott’s empathy problem today. but do you want to hit us with the card? It appears to me that you have pulled a card. We have pulled previously. We have? It looks like it. I don’t think so. Motivation. No no, no. Okay, so this is the.
00;13;56;22 – 00;14;16;04
Unknown
This is the seahorse, by the way. The other day, I saw a, a Facebook video or something of a seahorse. You know that males give birth. Yeah. And it was shooting out. I know, thousands of babies. I want to throw up the grossest, I know thing I have ever seen. Oh, gross. And then somebody goes, how many of those survive?
00;14;16;11 – 00;14;40;05
Unknown
And then. And then he’s like, oh, not done yet. Still punching and no punches. Like, can you make it stop? I hate that I don’t I don’t know yeah I don’t. So you saw it too. Yeah. Yeah I didn’t want to okay, but I did I hate that, so gross. Oh my God. Okay. All right. Well it’s 301 since motivation, which I thought was interesting because my solar plexus, I got the solar plexus burning over here.
00;14;40;05 – 00;15;01;03
Unknown
And then, the one over the oil, that’s all gone is for purpose. Okay. And then this says motivation, and I, I kind of feel like this is speaking to me because I’ve had a I’ve had a corner turn. Okay. Hold on, I gotta find what’s that mean, a corner turn. I finally feel I finally feel hormonally balanced.
00;15;01;03 – 00;15;18;02
Unknown
And I’m not trying every day, and. Oh, wow. Because the. Up your meds. Oh, we did it again. Again? Yeah. Yes. Here we are now. We are now in the zone. Wow. Yeah, I feel really great. That’s what we. That’s what we need to tame the beast inside. Yes. Sorry. That’s a that’s a great. Okay. Hold on once.
00;15;18;03 – 00;15;47;27
Unknown
Okay. Three of wands. The meaning is motivation. This this three brings energy and enthusiasm to all of your activities. And in love predicts a new relationship and celebration, such as a wedding and engagement. this three is also a brilliant card for travel and for the arts and sports too, showing a dynamic attitude that gets results. You may find yourself taking an unusual approach to a dilemma or situation, finding an ingenious way to problem solve and get your message across.
00;15;47;29 – 00;16;13;10
Unknown
So the advice is to think literally. Try new ways. Oh, I’m sorry, think laterally. Try new ways to fire your communication and creativity. I’m like, that didn’t make sense. Think literally. Think laterally. So what’s interesting? This is so funny. This comes laterally. Make no lateral. Yeah. Laterally. I have two huge I’m traveling next week and I’m going on, on my dad’s trip with, my group.
00;16;13;10 – 00;16;30;10
Unknown
And we’re doing some things that are a little bit different and true to form, four days out, things continue to come up that I have to problem solve and put fires out and things like that. And, the same is happening with another trip I’m going on in two weeks to a different event that I’ve never done before.
00;16;30;15 – 00;16;54;06
Unknown
But what’s exciting is, we talked about your cup. Yeah, you’re the world’s best. And so because I’m a world’s best pivot, I’m making magic happen. Yep. I might as well have that magic number. Yeah, but. And so, what’s funny is I’m totally motivated by that. I’m totally motivated because I do believe things, quote unquote, happen for a reason.
00;16;54;06 – 00;17;11;21
Unknown
I know that that sounds terrible, but when when one thing falls apart that seems devastating. I don’t look at it like that. I’m like, there’s a reason that wasn’t supposed to happen. It’s disappointing. Grieve it for a couple minutes, but then something better is going to come along. And that’s what’s been happening, which is really cool. So really excited to go to the Florida Keys.
00;17;11;21 – 00;17;29;23
Unknown
Remember we went there. Oh yeah. really excited to do that. I’m sure I’ll have some stories. I’m sure, you know. Oh, yeah. Yeah, there may be a chance I’m going fishing. Did I have a dream last night? Because I was doing all the fishing. I’m chartering 13 fishing boats. And, Did I have a dream last night that you and I were on this?
00;17;29;26 – 00;17;45;01
Unknown
Not a cruise ship, but we were fishing, and it was huge. Swordfish. Oh, God. And you were the one pulling it into the boat? Yeah. Of course. And I’m the one that’s like, get that shit away from. Yeah, I don’t know, I don’t like it’s. No, it’s. And I was like that. It was like coming real close I don’t.
00;17;45;02 – 00;18;01;02
Unknown
Yeah, yeah. It was just us. Yeah. We’re just fishing. Just the two of us. Yeah, yeah. But then who was driving the boat, captain. Oh, we had no, there was like a crew. Oh, okay. That’s good. Yeah, yeah. So it was. It was real weird. And then I had a real weird dream the night before about a person.
00;18;02;19 – 00;18;27;21
Unknown
Oh yeah. So yeah we’ll talk about, we’ll talk about that later. That was next level. Speaking of dreams, this is, this is so tangential. But Mark comes up this morning. from being downstairs and he’s the guy I had this dream and it was about flooding and there’s so much water. And then he’s like, your dad pops his head out, and I’m looking for Carter, and he’s telling me this whole story that then leads into a conversation.
00;18;27;21 – 00;18;48;27
Unknown
He’s like, oh, speaking of Carter, he said, I was just downstairs and we were watching this thing on Michael Jordan on TV and how one of the games that Michael Jordan was playing, they had one of the audience members come down and shoot the ball to try and win. You know what? Our money. Yeah, right. And so the guy shot and made it, which is not something you would ever I mean from like half court.
00;18;48;27 – 00;19;13;18
Unknown
Oh like. Yeah. Oh, father. Right. Like he made this unsuitable shot and ends up winning $1 million. But the insurance company never paid it out. So Michael Johnson. Johnson. Jordan. Jordan. Well, there’s a Michael Johnson. Well yeah there is, but that’s not it. Oh was it Jordan. Jordan. Yeah. More like from Space Jam. Yeah yeah yeah Michael Jordan okay.
00;19;14;23 – 00;19;39;15
Unknown
Michael Jordan gets the Bulls and yeah, he himself to pay this man $1 million. He earned it. Damn it. I know which I which I very much appreciated. Which then led Carter to be like, oh, I think Michael Jordan has, like, billions of dollars and marks, like. Yeah, you know, probably he’s still making money off merch, you know, just associated with his name.
00;19;39;15 – 00;20;03;28
Unknown
He’s incredibly famous. And Carter’s like, well, it’s kind of like us at our house. You know, we have millions of dollars as well. And Marcus. Yeah, what do we think? So. And he’s like, yeah. And he goes, what makes you think that? We have millions of dollars? And he goes, mom, she has a podcast, I love him, I love that shirt.
00;20;04;00 – 00;20;22;29
Unknown
By the way, I know you didn’t look it up, but, 3.2 billion is his net worth. Oh, okay. Okay with a B. So that is a really well lawyer things. So we used to think we were rich because we live in a raised ranch and our living room was upstairs. She’s like nobody else. Nobody else has a living room.
00;20;23;00 – 00;20;42;05
Unknown
And hi, I’m Sarah and I’m like, what? Yeah, yeah, I was growing up. You have the funniest things. I love this growing up. All right. So now I’m going to let you into a little bit of my past. Oh, boy. Okay. You know, here we go. Okay, so I grew up in South Florida. Of course. As you know, I think, you know, because of the Gators.
00;20;42;12 – 00;21;06;16
Unknown
Right, right. so we live for the first, let’s see, from first grade until sixth grade, we lived in a mobile home, what they call a trailer. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Back in. Was it a double wide are single, double wide, single wide. I would have gone out of my mind. it was a double wide. It, some double wide a very nice.
00;21;06;16 – 00;21;21;16
Unknown
It was the Cadillac of mobile home. I bet it was great. But what could have been the the vigor of mobile mobile homes? I’m not sure. I mean, I’m a non-gender. I live in one right now. This is half my married year at the time. At the time, they were all the rage in the late 70s, early 80s.
00;21;21;22 – 00;21;43;02
Unknown
Right. I used to be so jealous of my friends that had actual houses. It’s like, oh, when you walk in your house, you don’t hear, oh, that’s so interesting. There aren’t, possums, a family of possums living under your house. That’s that’s really cool. see, these are things that I never I just don’t think about. I don’t compare what I have to other people.
00;21;43;02 – 00;22;00;25
Unknown
I never did when I was growing up. I mean, I grew up without a dad. Everybody else I knew had a dad. I wasn’t like going, wish I had a dad. It just wasn’t. This is what’s so fascinating is you’re so fascinating. Just so fast. We moved into an apartment. Scott’s in this moment where he is like, let me tell you about this thing, that I don’t know why I feel that way.
00;22;00;25 – 00;22;23;03
Unknown
So uncomfortable with any feelings that come up for Scott about his trailer home that you immediately go to. Oh, I don’t know why everything’s so great. I didn’t even know if we had about a trailer. Here I am over here like I’m only. I’m only, you know, speaking of, I’m looking with through today’s lens. oh. Time.
00;22;23;03 – 00;22;51;18
Unknown
At the time, it wasn’t like we were ashamed of it. Okay. No. Okay. All right, just clarify. But when I went to my friend’s houses, who had a house and they had, like, a yard, and, you know, it was it was cool. Okay, well, different because I hadn’t lived in a house before. Okay. Actually, from the time that we moved to Florida, when I was five, I didn’t live into an honest like real house until I was 18.
00;22;51;20 – 00;23;09;21
Unknown
Oh, we lived in the trailer home. We lived in apartments, and we lived in a townhouse. So it wasn’t till I was 18 till my parents actually bought a house that I. We lived in a house. Wow. And that was a big deal for me. It was huge. It was like a house with a pool and a yard.
00;23;09;23 – 00;23;27;13
Unknown
Moving on. that. Oh my gosh. See, I’m in my mind. I’m like, Phillip, can we move to an apartment so we don’t have to mow the lawn? There’s a well, as I got older, I did appreciate the apartment living a little bit. Yes, it’s a lot of pluses for the clowns. Oh, we had the clowns that lived next door.
00;23;27;13 – 00;23;50;18
Unknown
Wow. That’s going to be another stop starting next time. If you ever get to hang out with Kelly, ask her about the clown. So her family from Tennessee in the apartment next to us, and there was like 50 people living in that room, like a little clown on the clowns. Yeah. So you’re saying that it’s funny how people’s or kids appreciation for what rich is?
00;23;50;18 – 00;24;13;04
Unknown
Yeah. Yeah. Differs. Yeah. Right. Yeah. It’s based on your own. Your own personal experience. Of course it. Well, Taylor Taylor says to me, I just got a new car and, she goes, oh, God, mom. I go, what? She goes, my friends already think we’re rich. Now this just confirms the deal. And I said, why? And she’s. And I think it’s because our house is picked up.
00;24;13;06 – 00;24;33;10
Unknown
Oh, because you don’t live in a shithole. I’m like, what about I go? Everything I buy is from the goodwill’s. I go, what makes it rich? I think it’s just because it’s esthetically pleasing and it’s picked up big and she’s like the bar. The bar is low bar and I think, wow, you know, it’s just really funny to me.
00;24;33;10 – 00;25;05;16
Unknown
But you’re right. Kids, kids interpretations. Very interesting. Yeah. I, I said, what did you say? Mark? And he is like, well, I felt left out. And so I said, you know, your dad makes money too. And I said, wow. Yeah. oh, what? I here’s what I really appreciate about that, Mark, is I really appreciate that you were able to identify that you felt left out in the conversation because before you would just be like, I told them, your dad makes money.
00;25;05;16 – 00;25;28;22
Unknown
He does. Well, dad brings home a paycheck, right? And I would have been like, that’s such an odd thing to say, right? But now he’s really starting to like, enter in the feeling component of why he sings. Like he’s letting me into some of the details about why he’s thinking the way that he is. It’s very helpful for someone who’s literally like me, because I’m usually like, whoa, we went where?
00;25;28;28 – 00;25;52;18
Unknown
What are you? We couldn’t just let that be like, right? So just him saying the word, I felt left out, right? I’m like, thank you. Really appreciate that. And then I was like, stop telling him that. I probably corrected him. It was probably like, yeah, so what? So yeah, your mom makes millions on a podcast on the let him let him think that that’s the case because it lands differently when he’s like, can we go get a new Jersey?
00;25;52;18 – 00;26;12;11
Unknown
I’m like, nope. Right. Well why not? Right, right. Because he doesn’t understand it has to do with money. It has everything to do with the fact that your mom has power to say, I don’t want to go to new Jersey on new Jersey. And unless a new sports, new sports Jersey. That’s funny, that’s funny. Well, it a new Jersey.
00;26;12;11 – 00;26;36;01
Unknown
I mean, it’s all bad driving, horrendous driving. It’s not even it’s not even the podcast. It’s the fact that the podcast is on YouTube. Oh yeah. That’s the part. It’s like we’re on YouTube when when we’re like friends with Mr. Beast, right? Oh yeah. But like the girls soccer team, the coach at the end of the year puts a compilation of all the pictures and then shows it through YouTube and they’re like, oh my God, we’re famous.
00;26;36;01 – 00;26;58;01
Unknown
Yeah, we’re on the YouTube. It’s it’s not even a shared link. But yeah, just because it’s on YouTube. Yeah. My favorite part is when Mark’s like, a mom doesn’t make money on her podcast. Carter’s like I’m like yeah I got that all battle hardened over here. Fool proof. Doesn’t matter what you tell that kid. He’s real clear who his mom is, what his mom does whether it’s true or not.
00;26;58;01 – 00;27;15;28
Unknown
Right, right, right. He’s he’s the kid that you know, when he goes up and starts talking about his experiences in life and he’s like, it was my mom. That’s my mom who made all the money. It was my mom who was famous. My mom, you know, worked a lot. My mom did it all right. Like, I’m really crafting the story over here, and then Mark’s over here.
00;27;15;28 – 00;27;37;25
Unknown
Like, what about me? Well, I told you. I told you what my soccer mom said to me the other day. She was like, my son came up to me, he’s five. My son, I’m tucking him into bed and and he goes, mom, I can’t wait to be a dad. And she goes, oh, really? Why? And he goes, because guys don’t do anything.
00;27;37;27 – 00;27;42;22
Unknown
I don’t see your bubble out there. So.
00;27;42;25 – 00;28;00;14
Unknown
Dad’s got. Dad’s got it made. You don’t have to do anything. That’s a good a good that’s a running joke. That’s a running joke at our house. Because my dad, when he was a girl, when I was growing up, my mom would be all, like, ragged, running around doing everything you possibly can. And I would be like, daddy, you gonna help with the dishes?
00;28;00;14 – 00;28;18;25
Unknown
And he’d go, I can’t. The cat’s on my lap. It’s the salad. I say, what I can’t, the cat’s on my lap, the cat’s on my lap. Is that the thing that we use all the time in my house? I’ll be upstairs watching TV, you know, doing whatever. And then Mark will be like, hey, could you come help with that?
00;28;18;25 – 00;28;34;05
Unknown
I’m like, I can’t, I know cat’s out of my now. Now it’s the dogs on my lap. I have a little dog. You do not want to go? Yeah. When to disturb. Yeah, right. You look over at the cat is absolutely not on Mark’s lap, but he’s on his phone and he’s like a cat. The cat’s on my lap.
00;28;34;07 – 00;28;56;02
Unknown
That’s where he is. okay. All right. Scott, so what we’re doing today is I asked Scott to bring us an empathy problem. I love it and to not tell us about it. Oh, boy. So you’re getting the real and raw here with Rebecca and Aaron because we don’t know anything about this. So we’re just going to have to answer this completely on the fly, which is my favorite.
00;28;56;02 – 00;29;12;24
Unknown
And tells me why we’re perfect for radio, because all we need is the call in show component where someone’s like, hey, I got to tell you what’s happening right now, and you know how we handle this? And then I’m like, here’s how we handle it. And you’re like, nope, here’s how we handle it. And then we’re like, sorry.
00;29;12;24 – 00;29;35;01
Unknown
We left you with mixed advice. I’m sure you have a good day. And then Scott’s like, I’m kind of in between the two of them, right. Okay. Thank you. We’ve left you with nothing. Thank you for calling. Yep. All right, so hit it. All right, Scott, we’re ready for you. At least we think we are. okay, so this is a parenting empathy problem.
00;29;35;01 – 00;30;07;29
Unknown
Oh, I got this, and I don’t I hopefully it doesn’t take me too long to get to the. I’ll skip right to the empathy problem of this. Okay. And there, I had a conversation with my mother yesterday, which, made me very upset because she was essentially judging my parenting without outwardly saying, I’m judging you, but she likes to give me advice that, it doesn’t.
00;30;08;01 – 00;30;34;13
Unknown
It’s not helpful because it doesn’t work with the day. It doesn’t? It’s advice from 45, 50 years ago. It just doesn’t work today. It doesn’t work. And you’re also I got this one. I got so and also she you know, she’s in Florida. She has not been around my kids but a few but a handful of times in the course of their lives and only knows what we say about them.
00;30;34;15 – 00;30;56;22
Unknown
She doesn’t know them fully, even though she’s their grandmother, and she feels like she knows them because they’re family. She doesn’t know them. So she it’s it’s not, helpful for her to give me advice. And it’s not there’s a there’s a way of giving advice and there’s a way of telling people this is what you’re supposed to do and you’re not doing that.
00;30;57;09 – 00;31;24;10
Unknown
Yeah. so anyway, I texted Kelly and I said, you know, another, another time, I remind me to never tell my mom what’s going on with the kids and just say everything’s fine. Yeah. And so then I kind of told her what happened, and she begged me to text my mom to to tell her to give her a piece of her mind and I was like, you will not do that.
00;31;25;02 – 00;31;46;00
Unknown
there’s no she wanted to do it. Kelly. Kelly wanted to tell you wanted to text her and say that da da da da. And I said no. I said, first of all, I don’t because Kelly doesn’t talk to my mom ever. unless she absolutely has to. There’s no outward, you know, problem. But she chooses not to have those conversations because they always end up like mine just did.
00;31;46;23 – 00;32;08;13
Unknown
Where she gives advice and it’s like you don’t understand. That’s not the situation. I can’t go into it now. Da da da da da. So I said you’re not going to do that because ultimately her advice comes from a place of love. It comes from a place of trying to help. She may be wrong. She may not understand the situation exactly how it it does.
00;32;08;13 – 00;32;33;20
Unknown
You know it. She can’t relate to it because she’s never gone through it. She didn’t raise kids. at the height of social media. She didn’t raise kids at the height of, you know, the anxiety epidemic and, Covid things that happened that Covid caused with our kids. She she didn’t, did not have that experience. So she can’t take the experience that she had raising kids and apply it to today.
00;32;33;20 – 00;32;51;14
Unknown
Some of it, yes, perhaps, but some of it does not compute. and so that was the problem we had. And I was having the conversation with my mom and I’m like, look, I and the reason why I called her is because we were at Kelly and I were at a store and I saw this little, this little tchotchke that I thought my mom would like.
00;32;51;14 – 00;33;05;27
Unknown
And I bought it, and I sent it to her, and I was calling her to see if she got it, and it was really. It was just a spur of the moment thing. I wanted to get her. And then I realized Mother’s Day is coming up. So I made it a mother’s day present, and I put the card in there and everything nice.
00;33;05;28 – 00;33;19;29
Unknown
And so I was just calling to see if she got my present. And then that turned into, I don’t want to have this conversation. I don’t want to get an argument with you right now, but you don’t understand. Yeah. And that’s you saying that? Yes. That’s so. And then she, you know, and then she was like, okay, well, you know that add on.
00;33;19;29 – 00;33;48;28
Unknown
And we moved on and we’re good at that. she, you’re good at moving on. We’re good at moving on from those conversations. I withdrawal from those conversations and say, whatever, let’s talk about something else. And I change the subject. And she picks up on that and goes with it. Oh, but in that period of time where we talk about it, it gets really frustrating for me because I’m like, Abby this and Abby that.
00;33;48;28 – 00;34;09;01
Unknown
She’s having trouble with this and, well, why don’t you just make her do this? And why don’t you just make her do that and take this away and take that away? And I’m like, no, that’s not how I operate. Those aren’t the way. That’s not the way I do things sometimes in the past, perhaps. But, you know, that’s like.
00;34;09;04 – 00;34;30;26
Unknown
You know, device addiction is a big thing. And I see you smirking, Rebecca, because I know that you probably would know. Do shots with my mom. No no no no no no no. In my mind, I’m thinking you can’t you can’t discipline a teenager the same way you discipline an eight year old, right? You don’t just take things away.
00;34;30;28 – 00;34;52;17
Unknown
But I know you have. I know you have a lot of those sort of old fashioned views on raising kids. I do, but your children are older than mine. Yeah. So Scott’s like, I think there’s two different. There’s it’s different. It’s different when when you’re dealing with a natural situation specifically when you mentioned technology. Yeah. It’s just different.
00;34;52;18 – 00;35;07;09
Unknown
My eight year old, it doesn’t get the same privileges as my 16 year old. Right. You know what I mean? That’s that’s the only difference in my kids. When my kids were eight, they didn’t have the technology wasn’t there. Yeah. Right. So they had they were playing with my flip phone. Right, right. It’s a very different world with it.
00;35;07;13 – 00;35;24;09
Unknown
Yeah. You know, and they had like these cheesy little, what, what were those things. It was like a, it was some sort of a play game, but it was educational, you know, it looked like a laptop or like. Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, I know what you’re talking about. I can’t think of the name. Yeah. It was just, like a leapfrog or whatever.
00;35;24;09 – 00;35;47;25
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, it was, it was by leapfrog. So it had the little cartridges and stuff and they played, but it was all learning stuff, so. But they were like, we’re playing games, right? Emulated what we had as adults. Yeah. Now they just have better things than we do. Yeah. But, you know, I’m trying to explain to her about my daughter and her anxiety issues and her her her self-esteem issues and the problems she went through with that guy online.
00;35;47;27 – 00;36;15;08
Unknown
It’s which is still being litigated. It’s this whole big thing that affected her greatly. and I think she’s doing really well, but she has good days and she has bad days. And it’s really hard to sum up my daughter’s last four years in a sentence and explain it properly to my mom, and she’s automatically going to say, well, you know, she needs to go out and do this, and she needs to go out and do this.
00;36;15;08 – 00;36;35;22
Unknown
You need to make her do this stuff. I’m like, I’m not going to sit there and go, you know what? She tried. She’s she’s gone for two different jobs, got accepted, started working and couldn’t take it. Her anxiety was through the roof. She couldn’t do it, so she had to quit. We didn’t want her to quit. We tried to keep her in the job, but it was really affecting her, her life.
00;36;36;11 – 00;36;53;23
Unknown
and so we’re we said, all right, you don’t have to work. You’re only 17. You’re still, you know, going to school, but you do have to go to therapy. You do have to. We do have to find where this is coming from and how to fix it and how to help you. I have some questions. Okay. How old is mom?
00;36;53;26 – 00;37;24;25
Unknown
My mom is, 8281. Okay. Two 1942. So she’s 82. Does she live alone? She lives with my dad, who’s, 85. Is your dad what we would call emotionally available? someone really hard question and someone that he’s emotional, but maybe not emotionally available. Okay, there he is. He cries, like, at the drop of a hat. Yeah, but he’s not necessarily good at the feelings thing.
00;37;24;27 – 00;37;35;05
Unknown
The. I mean, you know, he’s he’s from the old school Irish, you know. Right. Right. What else does mom have outside of dad?
00;37;35;07 – 00;37;56;06
Unknown
Nothing. Nothing anymore. She used to work. She used to help. elderly, which I thought was funny because they’re, like, five years older than her. But, that’s like me helping Rebecca when we get to that extent. But she’s. You know, she used to take these ladies to their doctor’s appointments and go take them shopping and that kind of stuff, and she just retired from that.
00;37;56;09 – 00;38;21;29
Unknown
Yeah, well that’s interesting. When does she retire? Yeah. I’d say within the last six months or a year. Oh, wow. Okay. Have you noticed a shift in the, types of conversations or the arguments that you’ve been getting in in the last six months? No, it’s always been like it has been like this. It’s. I have two sisters in law, and they’re both saying they’re both are like, well, that’s mom.
00;38;21;29 – 00;38;53;11
Unknown
You know, you just they’re in Florida. So they deal with her on a regular basis. So they learn, they’ve learned to navigate that. But we moved away and Kelly was like, I ain’t dealing with that. And she hasn’t. Well how would you characterize your relationship with your mom. It’s good. It is. Yeah. And do you wish that the relationship was had a deeper connection or that you could have conversations with her that did not constantly lead to some form of argument?
00;38;53;13 – 00;39;13;04
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, that’d be great. It would be great if I could tell her what’s going on with my family and have her just listen, because. Why? Because that’s what I want. Why? Why else? Outside of what you want? What would it mean to you if that was the type of relationship you had with your mom? What do you mean?
00;39;13;06 – 00;39;28;25
Unknown
What would it mean to you to be able to have that type of relationship where you could call your mom and you could talk to her and you could tell her what’s going on and on the other end of the line, she’s saying things like, oh my gosh, that sounds so difficult. You know what, Scott, though, here’s what I know about you.
00;39;28;27 – 00;39;54;21
Unknown
You’re super smart and your super capable. And so is Kelly. She she does that. She does that. I just think that when it comes to my kids, she automatically has to tell me what we should be doing as opposed to saying, well, you’re a good parent, so I’m sure you’re going to do the right thing. That’s all I really want.
00;39;55;03 – 00;40;15;10
Unknown
you know, unless I say, mom, what if I do? I deal with this situation, but that’s not what I’m saying. She asks me how the kids are, and I say, well, you know, so-and-so’s having a problem with this. Well, why tell me about that part? That part I think is fascinating. What I don’t want to say too much on the podcast is because I know not about the specifics.
00;40;15;10 – 00;40;36;26
Unknown
Okay. But when when she says House, the kids. Yeah. What part of you wants to share the details and the information as opposed to saying, kids are good kids? Yeah, I want to share. I want to tell her, I want to answer her question. If she asks me how the kids are, she’s asking me because she cares and I want to give her the answer.
00;40;36;26 – 00;40;52;27
Unknown
I want to tell her. I want her to know what’s going on with my kids. You know, I don’t want her to think everything’s fine. If it’s not fine, if it is fine, then that’s what I’ll tell her. But if it’s not fine, I want to say Sean’s doing this. John’s doing this. Abby’s doing this. There’s this problem.
00;40;52;27 – 00;41;13;05
Unknown
There’s that problem. You know, because that’s how. That’s how life is. Life is not like everything’s fine. No matter how much you want to, you know, pretend it is. But there’s always something going on. And it’s easy to to when you have someone. If someone asks you that, you know, unless she’s just asking to to, you know, like saying, hey, how are you feeling today?
00;41;13;05 – 00;41;29;07
Unknown
Or hey, how are you doing? And then someone answers you and they’re like, well. And you’re like, oh shit. But I don’t think that’s the way it is. I think she legitimately wants to know because she cares, because they’re her grandkids and I’m the baby of the family, my bro. Both my brothers are ten and 11 years older than me.
00;41;29;07 – 00;41;56;01
Unknown
So they were, you know, out of the house. I was still a little kid. so in a lot of ways, I’m the I’m like an only child. I have a lot of thoughts about this. I’m curious, but where where would you go. What were what would your thoughts be. What what are your thoughts. I can I can absolutely relate to wanting to just share.
00;41;56;04 – 00;42;18;07
Unknown
And I’m the type of person that I unless I specifically ask for advice, I’m not looking for it. Just because I’m sharing something with you doesn’t mean I want your opinion. In fact, I don’t want your opinion at all. I’m just sharing it so I absolutely can understand your feelings of I want. I want her to be in the know, but I’m not looking for a solution and when they do offer up things, it’s nice.
00;42;18;07 – 00;42;34;27
Unknown
And I’ve learned this a lot in my life. I just take people’s advice with a grain of salt and think, okay, you’re so way off base, it’s fine. But you know, so I can understand that. And I also understand and relate to the fact of the generation difference. I mean, my mom’s not in her 80s, but she’s in her 60s.
00;42;34;27 – 00;42;55;16
Unknown
And there’s a significant generation difference. Significant. It’s just different. You know, and the other component with my family is I grew up with the single mom and no dad. My mom was the end all be all decision maker. There was no conversation to be had. Yeah I’m married I’m married in a house and with two different family values.
00;42;55;16 – 00;43;21;17
Unknown
And we have to come together and raise our kids as a family unit. So sometimes my mom gets very confused about why things would happen a certain way because she’s like, that’s not how we would have done it. I’m like, I know, but I don’t get to pull rank. Right. You know, so and I can relate with what you’re saying to Scott because my parents live in an in-law suite attached to my home and they are in their 70s.
00;43;21;19 – 00;44;06;26
Unknown
And one of the unintended side effects that I did not know was going to be a part of that experience was how much their opinions and how much any past, relationship dynamics, family dynamics existed when I was growing up. We’re going to transfer over into them living next door and little things like, I’ve been attuned to the ways in which my dad displeases things or is, you know, silently judging the shit out of something over the last 42 years because I lived with him for 25 of those years.
00;44;06;28 – 00;44;46;00
Unknown
And so now when he lives next door and he verbally will not say how he feels about something, it does not mean I’m any more or less in the know about how he feels about that particular thing. And one of the dynamic issues you’re talking about is alive and well for me, and I think is alive and well for all people when it comes to their parents, is that if we have not appropriately and I don’t know the best way to do this, but appropriately let go of or changed the relationship dynamic from when we were little, which is mom and dad know best.
00;44;46;00 – 00;45;07;22
Unknown
Mom and dad are the decision makers. Mom and dad’s role is to keep me safe. Mom and dad’s role is to tell me things that I don’t know about myself to educate me. If that doesn’t change throughout the course of in moving into adulthood, then you see the same family experience play itself out at the age of 50 and 81.
00;45;07;22 – 00;45;40;10
Unknown
Yeah, at the age of 42 and 74. Right. Like there’s still this ingrained, almost like it was required of us for survival at such a young age, so embedded that we look for the approval of our parents, even if that parent is not connected to us in some way, even if that parent was a really shitty parent, and especially if that parent played a really meaningful role in our life.
00;45;40;13 – 00;46;02;00
Unknown
And I, I saw it even with my mom and her mom as my grandma was dying. Still, my mom was only child is having this feeling of have I done enough? Is it good enough? Is it good enough for my mom? Would she approve of what was happening here? even my my grandma was losing her mind toward the end, and it was still very much this, like.
00;46;02;06 – 00;46;42;19
Unknown
Well, grandma would have liked it this particular way, right? My mom was in her early 70s or her late 60s, and her mother was close to 90, still experiencing that type of relationship dynamic. Right. and I just find that fascinating. And I found that to be one of the things that stuck out to me about your story, Scott, is we as children always have the desire to connect in a meaningful way with our significant parent, whether that be the mom or the dad, or maybe it’s a guardian, or maybe it’s a grandma or whatever.
00;46;42;21 – 00;47;25;06
Unknown
And it is the one place that we turn to for unconditional love and support. And when we don’t get that, whether that’s outright or whether that’s through advice or whether that’s through anything that feels displeasing in some way, it is so incredibly hurtful because is there the one person in the world that’s supposed to be the safe place where you go to have these conversations, where that relationship is off, however, is that that person, that mom, that parent, that guardian has also not shifted their role, which is that of caretaking and all they care about.
00;47;25;06 – 00;47;45;01
Unknown
At the end of the day, like you said, Scott, she’s coming from a place of love and compassion. She wants to fix it. She she wants to fix it. She wants to to solve your problems. Right? That that’s really what it is. And I and I hear that and I get that. But at the same time, yeah, it’s really it’s difficult it’s frustrating because you, there’s, it’s unavoidable.
00;47;45;01 – 00;48;05;29
Unknown
But there’s a, there’s a level of judgment in that, that you feel whether or not it’s intentional or it’s subtle, whatever, it’s there. And so you can’t help but get on the defensive while you’re doing it wrong. You should do it this way. And now it’s like, now you’re jumping on my back about how I know the kind of parent I am.
00;48;06;14 – 00;48;25;07
Unknown
And and know what your unconditional approval. I want your unconditional I if I’m going to run into a street maybe let me know. But otherwise at the end of the day, even if I’m making a really terrible decision, what I want to feel from you is it’s fine. We’re going to get through this. I love you no matter what.
00;48;25;07 – 00;48;46;28
Unknown
It’s unconditional. And, you know, in the past I have tried to say. I said, like, I know that you’re just trying to help mom, but there’s so much involved with this that it’s really hard for me to go through and explain it all. So I, you know, but even if you did explain it all, it still wouldn’t be.
00;48;46;28 – 00;49;04;24
Unknown
No, I understood, I don’t yeah, but you know, I say, I know you’re coming in, you’re coming from a place to, to try to help me. And I appreciate that. But you know, your, your advice actually is not translating with today. It’s, there’s a lot of other stuff and, and I leave it at that and she’ll go, oh all right, well fine.
00;49;04;26 – 00;49;31;21
Unknown
And then I feel like I’ve hurt her feelings. That part right there is the saddest part of all of this for me, because this is what happens constantly in relationships, no matter who it is. You have two people that feel hurt, two people that feel unheard, two people that feel like they did not get their needs met. And then it’s an agree to disagree and we’re just going to move on and let that go.
00;49;31;21 – 00;50;03;02
Unknown
Right. Or we don’t ever let it go. It’s carries with us into the next conversation. It just sounds different. Right. And that is the part that I don’t think anyone is so properly or adequately trained at being able to heal their own self in that conversation, or to heal the relationship in that conversation. And I will give you an example of how I did this recently, and it was really hard for me to do, and it’s hard for me to do, which you both know means it’s really effin hard for other people to do, because I do this stuff all the time, right?
00;50;03;05 – 00;50;26;05
Unknown
I had a situation with my dad that I did not like, how that conversation went. It actually really made me angry and I was seething upstairs. And so the very next day, I needed to take my car to the, the car place, car shop. and I see that my mom has her coat on. She and my dad are ready to go take me to the car dealership.
00;50;26;05 – 00;50;47;13
Unknown
And I say, actually, mom, I’m just going with dad. And she’s like, oh, okay, okay. All right. And she goes outside and she’s like, Aaron, just wanted to go with you to the car dealership, so I’m just going to stay here. She says she has something she wants to talk to you about now, in this moment. You know, John, no matter how military this man is, he’s a little nervous right now.
00;50;47;13 – 00;51;09;06
Unknown
Well, you are very scary. Well, and I’m nervous for you. I would never show, but I’m like, this is my idea, right? Right. This dynamic is alive and well, right? So I have thought all night about how I was going to address the situation with him. And boy, there was a wide variability. One started with who the f do you think?
00;51;09;06 – 00;51;41;00
Unknown
Right. One started with, you know, I might be wrong about this, but and thankfully I landed on much more of a middle ground. So after he drops me off at the car, I say, why don’t we go to the coffee shop? He’s like, okay. And I said, I’m going to start with this. I feel so sad that you grew up in a decade and in an environment that did not allow men to have feelings greater than the need for control, or greater than the need for anger.
00;51;41;02 – 00;52;02;22
Unknown
And I’m seeing that play out in our family dynamic in myriad ways that we don’t need to get into the details of. But I’m noticing myself react differently to you, and it makes me really sad that as we move into this third phase of life, I find myself having feelings about you that are not the feelings that I want to have now.
00;52;02;22 – 00;52;29;16
Unknown
This man sat there hard, really effing hard and hard to say and hard to hear. Then we ended up in a coffee shop for 2.5 hours. Yeah. Tears, Cinnamon rolls with everything you could possibly imagine was happening here. It was a beautiful conversation, and one of the things I had said in that conversation was, I don’t care how old we get, your approval means something to me.
00;52;29;18 – 00;53;06;00
Unknown
I don’t want it to mean something to me. At the age of 42, honestly, I want to be able to just be like, oh, well, whatever. That’s my dad in it. Does it mean something to me? And I have felt my entire existence. I know you better than almost any other human being in this world, and I know you better in some ways than mom does, because I have a different interaction pattern with you, and I need you to know that I see you, and I need you to know that I know that you’re an emotional person, and I need you to know that every time you give advice, you have opinions, you get angry.
00;53;06;00 – 00;53;20;26
Unknown
You respond in a certain way. I know it’s coming from love, and I’m going to be real honest with you. If it wasn’t, we wouldn’t be sitting here right now. It would be different, right? And you, you know the difference. Yes. You can feel it. Feel it, you know. Yes, I know this is where this is coming from.
00;53;20;26 – 00;53;38;05
Unknown
And that’s why we’re having this conversation. I said, so what I need you to know is I need you to hear me say that every single opinion you have pierces me in some way. It makes me feel like I’m not good enough. It makes me feel like I’m not smart enough. It makes me feel like I’m making bad decisions.
00;53;38;05 – 00;54;05;15
Unknown
And I’m disappointing you. Like I’m a failure. Like, I have a brother who’s seven years older, so it makes me feel like if I do not serve in the way that I’m supposed to, or make the right decisions, that you will have a more favorable response to Brian than you do to me. And I’m okay with it being equal, but I’m not okay with it feeling like you have different, you know, feel ings or care or love.
00;54;05;18 – 00;54;34;07
Unknown
It makes me feel like it’s not conditional. And in his response was quite fascinating. It was. I never mean for it to come across like that in. My response was, it doesn’t matter how you mean for it to come across, it still feels the same to me. And I don’t need you to address what you meant. I need you to see me and how this has a reaction for me.
00;54;34;29 – 00;54;55;24
Unknown
I then moved on and gave it an example. I said, do you remember the time that Mark was spray painting his office in the basement? And he’s like, oh yeah, yeah, I do. I said that one small example was me in a complete tizzy, thinking to myself, I want Mark to be able to spray paint his office.
00;54;55;24 – 00;55;15;27
Unknown
It’s his office. I don’t care what it looks like. I don’t care if he wants roll on paint or spray paint. I want him to feel comfortable in that space. I’ve wanted to make that his space, and I want him to feel comfortable in his own home. While that’s happening, I’m thinking to myself the whole time, John is not okay with this.
00;55;16;00 – 00;55;38;27
Unknown
There’s not enough ventilation. He’s having concerns about the fumes that are downstairs. He’s wondering where the spray paint is going. He’s wondering if Mark has the escape window, egress window open. Even if he has the egress window open, there’s not enough fans down there, right? I said that one small thing. I said, what should I do? Dad, this is rhetorical.
00;55;39;04 – 00;55;57;10
Unknown
What should I do in that situation? Do I support my husband and making sure that he has an office that he wants, even if he’s spray painting, which wouldn’t have been my first choice? Or do I appease my father, who I know is going to be upset and have anxiety and difficulty with the fact that this is how he chose to do it?
00;55;57;12 – 00;56;18;09
Unknown
I said, dad, this is about spray paint. So now have it be about my kid. Now have it be about my marriage now have it be about all of these other things that are just so much more important. And you can see how that intensifies. And his response in that moment was, I never looked at it that way.
00;56;18;14 – 00;56;55;03
Unknown
And I never mean to put you in that position. What he said next was the most important part. I’m going to do a better job of controlling my own reactions, of wanting you to be okay so that you really can be okay. And I’m like that is effing profound. And what I hear you saying, Scott, is your mom needs to do a better job of controlling her need for you to be okay, for the ability to make space for you to actually be okay.
00;56;55;16 – 00;57;12;15
Unknown
this is an example where empathy comes in. People are trying really hard. They want you to be okay. They want you to have a good life. They want all of these things for you. But when you want all of that and your want and need for that to happen for me is greater than how I’m genuinely feeling in that moment.
00;57;12;15 – 00;57;22;15
Unknown
That’s when we’re running into these types of issues. Hell of a way to end an episode. Seriously.
00;57;22;17 – 00;57;51;26
Unknown
You you use your words prettier than a $20. Ha ha ha ha ha ha, I loved that. Me too. Isn’t empathy amazing? Well we’re amazing. I don’t know about all this empathy stuff. That’s fine. I accept you wherever you are. Oh, God, I love you. I love you too. And if you love us, please like and subscribe to More Love the Power of Empathy podcast wherever you get your podcasts.
00;57;52;04 – 00;58;01;22
Unknown
See you next time.
Unknown
Hey, it’s me Erin Thanks for joining us on the Moor Love podcast. Do not tell Rebecca, but this podcast is about empathy. She likes people to think she’s dead inside. But the truth is, she’s a big time feeler who has truly helped me uncover that empathy is my superpower. Here she comes. Hey, bestie. Hi, love. What are you doing?
00;00;31;11 – 00;00;56;11
Unknown
Oh, just getting ready to host a podcast. A podcast about what? Our life. Our life is. Best friends who are more like sisters. Yay! I love us, and I can’t wait to share stories of the world, especially the ones that involve us pushing each other right to be our most authentic selves. Wow, man. Okay.
00;00;56;13 – 00;01;18;05
Unknown
What? I just gotta open the oil. Yeah, and I’m like, what’s wrong with it? It’s all leaked out onto the cardboard. Oh, the smell it. Oh, my God, it smells so good. It doesn’t. Look at what happened. How come the top side of it, which would shock Royal, is that this is the solar plexus. Look at the belly button when it’s gone.
00;01;18;27 – 00;01;38;12
Unknown
You’re smiling. Yeah. Let’s just take the box and wipe it on your boob. Oh that’s not so bad. It’s like lemon pledge. Well. Oh so we’re plexus. More lemon please. Yes, I have it. That’s not it. Thank you. So much for putting that on your neck. I really appreciate that. It only took about two, so I to throw this away.
00;01;38;13 – 00;01;46;06
Unknown
Yeah. It’s gone. But then I will have a complete set.
00;01;46;08 – 00;02;02;24
Unknown
I have so many thoughts and feelings right now. I gotta throw it away. I’m like, I was wondering why my car is smelling really good. Why would we keep. It was my first thought. My next thought was okay. I mean, it’s important to her. So give it a minute and then I’m like, it’s an empty bottle. I know I’m not a hoarder.
00;02;02;24 – 00;02;22;17
Unknown
And you’re not going to keep the that thing you’re about to throw away. So I’m sorry, I that is an example of a time where I came to a conclusion quicker than you did. So maybe one example is just one. But I forgot about my, my cards today. Okay. Having the cards? No, no, no. Getting them out.
00;02;22;20 – 00;02;41;06
Unknown
Oh, why don’t you tell Scott what I sent you a picture of? Oh, my God, this morning. So she sends me a text message, and it’s just a, you know, an attachment, which is not unusual. In fact, Scott, you got your phone? Yeah, as a matter of fact, I do. Okay. Then I don’t want to tell, because. This will let me just send you a little ditty here.
00;02;41;12 – 00;03;06;12
Unknown
I want Scott’s reaction. Okay. Let’s see. It’s. What time was it that I sent this to you? 825. Okay. It’s not the first thing in your camera roll. Yeah. It is. I just had to pull up Scott’s phone number. Oh, okay. Sorry, Scott. Just look at the whole picture. Oh, what do you say? What do you mean? What do you see in the stories?
00;03;06;14 – 00;03;27;19
Unknown
Oh, yeah. What do you see, Scott? Who do you see? I see coach. Listen, we have to talk about this. This is. This is not okay. So this is it. I go, oh, that’s a vagina. That’s what I thought I was. Harry. Vagina. I’m thinking it’s one of those tricks where it’s actually, like, somebody’s neck, but for some reason.
00;03;27;24 – 00;03;49;03
Unknown
Oh. That’s funny. A vagina. This person is really funny. Listen, don’t say the name out loud. Okay? Listen. I don’t even know who that is. That lady. That. No, no, this is the one I have to talk to you about that. Okay? Because the profile picture doesn’t match the story. I can’t believe you just said that. And I can’t wait to talk about that, too.
00;03;49;09 – 00;04;23;19
Unknown
All right. Listen. Lay it on me. This is a girl that I went to high school with. Incessantly bullied. When I say she’s all right. When I. Yes, she’s. She’s Irish. Yes. When I say bullied, I mean incredibly, an incredible story of someone who persevered through people being. She was the the person that people would choose as the butt of their jokes every single time.
00;04;23;21 – 00;04;53;17
Unknown
Except for me. I know I am the one. Who would say hi to her in the hall? I am the one who would go over to her locker. I am the one who would see her sitting alone and lunch. Right? Because when you talk about empathy is just this ingrained piece I felt constantly. Every time I saw her, just this incredible sense of sadness for her.
00;04;53;20 – 00;05;17;07
Unknown
So Facebook becomes a thing. And she friends me on Facebook. 100% accept it. I have never had any conversations with her since, right. But I have seen some of her. I mean, this is when we were in college. Posted. Yeah. Okay. So that long ago this was like not weeks ago. And we’ve been friends from the beginning on Facebook.
00;05;17;14 – 00;05;40;01
Unknown
Okay. Yeah. And, the other day I go in and open up Facebook, and that is still to this moment. The the first thing what I just sent to you and Scott is the first thing that pops up. You got the word Facebook on the top. You got the Facebook stories and then you got, like, everyone s feed comments on there.
00;05;40;04 – 00;06;10;15
Unknown
So I see in this story this hairy vagina and I’m perplexed because it’s next to this woman’s name. So I when I’m telling you that every single feeling is going through me right now, I’m thinking to myself, this is what’s going on. Okay, I’m going to walk you through this. Well, maybe maybe she has a new job. Maybe what?
00;06;10;17 – 00;06;33;09
Unknown
This is part of OnlyFans. Maybe she really turned a new leaf. Well, there’s no way that that’s her vagina. Why would I? That’s why I’m saying it didn’t match. Why would I think that wasn’t her vagina? Why would I be judging people’s vaginas? That’s a lot of hair. Why is the underwear pulled off a little bit to the side?
00;06;33;15 – 00;06;56;13
Unknown
That looks like a vagina wedgie. This is what is going on for me. I’d like you to know that the tone I just read that in was like, really? It’s only been really good. I ate Asmr, so, what do I do? I screenshot it and I send it to Mark. Okay. Now, Mark knows her because we went to high school together.
00;06;57;23 – 00;07;22;20
Unknown
What’s his first comment? That’s not her badge okay. Okay. So what do I do? I send it to Becky Boyle. Also went to high school. What’s her first comment. That’s not her fancy. Wasn’t I, I then call Nina and I say I gotta tell you this thing happen and I got to send you this picture.
00;07;22;21 – 00;07;47;21
Unknown
I send the picture to her. She goes oh God, what the heck is going on? The questions that keep coming up, why did that not get taken down from Facebook yet? Why is that still on her stories? Is that really her vagina? Probably not. So did she get scammed? Like T had to. Hacked. Taken over by by bots?
00;07;47;26 – 00;08;12;03
Unknown
Well, if she did, then I’m thinking, oh my gosh, I have to contact her. I need to contact her. And I need to be the one to say, I don’t know if you know this, but there’s a picture of legs with a very hairy vag on your stories, and I don’t want that for you. If you don’t want that for you.
00;08;12;05 – 00;08;33;13
Unknown
She goes, I want that for you. You don’t want that for you. If you don’t want that for you. If you want that for you, that’s great. can I ask that we maybe take that off of Facebook? Maybe not the place. Right? Like, I mean, just use this as an opportunity to talk about appropriateness. So then I send it to Rebecca this morning at 830 in the morning.
00;08;33;13 – 00;08;56;10
Unknown
And what did you say? I said, oh, my God, that’s a fat. And then what did you say? I said, it’s a kind of a nice image. I gotta tell you, I mean, if you’re going have a hairy badge, I mean, I guess it’s a hairy badge. That’s nice. I don’t know. It is the the white underwear that looks like cotton candy thongs.
00;08;56;11 – 00;09;16;07
Unknown
Oh, yeah. Pulled off to the side. I don’t understand. Which pushes the push part. Makes me highly uncomfortable. The whole thing is uncomfortable. How? That’s not something you should see in a story. How about every time you open up your Facebook page? That’s. That’s the first thing that’s popping up. Wynona’s Harry Beaver looking right at you. Like, no, I’m not.
00;09;16;10 – 00;09;36;25
Unknown
That’s right. Oh, why? But why? Don’t know. How did you contact her? No, I haven’t yet. Should I? I will just report it just for you. I can’t, she’s she’s a victim of bullying. What if she really wants that picture? I can’t, I’m not going to be the one. You know, if that. If that’s her taking some of her power back.
00;09;36;25 – 00;09;53;27
Unknown
More power to her. Because I’m not. I can’t ignore it. You want to take it? You want to ignore it? How often do you go on Facebook? Every single day. No. What I do is I. I will either, because I’ve had some people that I follow that have put up some kind of not things that I don’t particularly care for.
00;09;54;00 – 00;10;13;03
Unknown
And so I will either mute their alerts or mute their whatever their story, you can mute a story, I think, or I will just unfollow them if I don’t want to take the drastic step of unfriending them. Like, I don’t like what that is, so I’m going to unfollow them. So now I don’t see that anymore so they can do it all they want, but I don’t see it.
00;10;13;04 – 00;10;36;28
Unknown
Right. But it’s the empathy component that she’s feeling like this girl doesn’t know I. She might. You have to write like set maybe shaved white horse and shave her shaved white or oh my god right. I’m assuming I took a wild guess. I, just based on her talking about that. I mean, that’s fun. Assumed you guys were cool.
00;10;36;28 – 00;11;02;10
Unknown
That’s a fun game. You shaved, waxed or bush? Wait. I’d say wait a minute, wait a minute. Do you not remember? Do you not remember going with us to the waxer place? Yes I do. Okay. So then you know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We don’t we don’t know about you, right? Because. Oh, me went in there for the first time at the age of 42 and had your eyebrows waxed for the first time ever, which I’ve never done again and never will.
00;11;02;13 – 00;11;26;13
Unknown
This is exactly. We’re still the same exact place that we were in your unitard. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God. So anyway, that’s that’s what we call empathy for Facebook stories, veg additions, vegetable patch additions. Nice. And it’s not it’s not great, but I think I need to say something about it because if she doesn’t know, she needs to.
00;11;26;13 – 00;11;55;08
Unknown
If she does know, I want to really embrace that for her and then unfollow it and, definitely unfollow. But I’m telling you, every time I go to open my Facebook app, it’s there. It’s it’s why your stories don’t just even change. It does not change. It keeps showing up over and over and over again. It’s fascinating the fact that so many people have been like, that’s not her fans who watch it.
00;11;55;10 – 00;12;11;01
Unknown
Well, I mean, that was like the second thing I said. I know there’s a. You don’t even know her, right? Oh, I didn’t even look at the picture of the I didn’t even look at the who’s. That’s my second thing. The first thing is wow. And then the second thing is, all right, who’s posting this? That’s funny. I didn’t even I didn’t even look at that.
00;12;11;01 – 00;12;32;01
Unknown
I just looked at the back. Better understand the situation. Now, let me delete this from my phone. So my mom, my mom, my mom, my mom doesn’t go through my my mom. No. So the reason why I said that is because, remember you texted me yesterday? Oh. Empathy problem. Yeah. I have an empathy problem that that is about my mom.
00;12;32;01 – 00;12;49;10
Unknown
So that’s. Oh. Oh, should we dive right in? Yeah. It is. I know it, and perhaps I don’t know. Oh. That’s funny. My mom, my son, my mom doesn’t see it, so my mom doesn’t see the picture that you sent me. Yeah. Oh my God. I get I’m going to go out on a limb here, but I think if Kelly saw that, she’d be like, more power to you, Scott.
00;12;49;10 – 00;13;13;07
Unknown
If that’s the way we’re headed, you know, God limb, go for you. The limb and fell to your death. Yeah, right. So. Yeah. not not a soft landing at all. I love that I’m like Mark, like that. Look at this. Check this out a little. Little bit. You know, I, I didn’t realize, but I married a nun who is not religious, is not a religious nun.
00;13;13;08 – 00;13;32;16
Unknown
Oh, she just doesn’t like. Oh, she doesn’t like her. She gets very uncomfortable with with things of of that nature. Oh, okay. Specifically because she doesn’t want you involved in the business of other women or any type of topic. Like, even right now, she’d be dying that we’re talking about this in the podcast. Yeah. She’d be like, oh, okay.
00;13;32;17 – 00;13;56;16
Unknown
Oh, she’d go, no, no, no, no. Love that. All right. We are going to dive into Scott’s empathy problem today. but do you want to hit us with the card? It appears to me that you have pulled a card. We have pulled previously. We have? It looks like it. I don’t think so. Motivation. No no, no. Okay, so this is the.
00;13;56;22 – 00;14;16;04
Unknown
This is the seahorse, by the way. The other day, I saw a, a Facebook video or something of a seahorse. You know that males give birth. Yeah. And it was shooting out. I know, thousands of babies. I want to throw up the grossest, I know thing I have ever seen. Oh, gross. And then somebody goes, how many of those survive?
00;14;16;11 – 00;14;40;05
Unknown
And then. And then he’s like, oh, not done yet. Still punching and no punches. Like, can you make it stop? I hate that I don’t I don’t know yeah I don’t. So you saw it too. Yeah. Yeah I didn’t want to okay, but I did I hate that, so gross. Oh my God. Okay. All right. Well it’s 301 since motivation, which I thought was interesting because my solar plexus, I got the solar plexus burning over here.
00;14;40;05 – 00;15;01;03
Unknown
And then, the one over the oil, that’s all gone is for purpose. Okay. And then this says motivation, and I, I kind of feel like this is speaking to me because I’ve had a I’ve had a corner turn. Okay. Hold on, I gotta find what’s that mean, a corner turn. I finally feel I finally feel hormonally balanced.
00;15;01;03 – 00;15;18;02
Unknown
And I’m not trying every day, and. Oh, wow. Because the. Up your meds. Oh, we did it again. Again? Yeah. Yes. Here we are now. We are now in the zone. Wow. Yeah, I feel really great. That’s what we. That’s what we need to tame the beast inside. Yes. Sorry. That’s a that’s a great. Okay. Hold on once.
00;15;18;03 – 00;15;47;27
Unknown
Okay. Three of wands. The meaning is motivation. This this three brings energy and enthusiasm to all of your activities. And in love predicts a new relationship and celebration, such as a wedding and engagement. this three is also a brilliant card for travel and for the arts and sports too, showing a dynamic attitude that gets results. You may find yourself taking an unusual approach to a dilemma or situation, finding an ingenious way to problem solve and get your message across.
00;15;47;29 – 00;16;13;10
Unknown
So the advice is to think literally. Try new ways. Oh, I’m sorry, think laterally. Try new ways to fire your communication and creativity. I’m like, that didn’t make sense. Think literally. Think laterally. So what’s interesting? This is so funny. This comes laterally. Make no lateral. Yeah. Laterally. I have two huge I’m traveling next week and I’m going on, on my dad’s trip with, my group.
00;16;13;10 – 00;16;30;10
Unknown
And we’re doing some things that are a little bit different and true to form, four days out, things continue to come up that I have to problem solve and put fires out and things like that. And, the same is happening with another trip I’m going on in two weeks to a different event that I’ve never done before.
00;16;30;15 – 00;16;54;06
Unknown
But what’s exciting is, we talked about your cup. Yeah, you’re the world’s best. And so because I’m a world’s best pivot, I’m making magic happen. Yep. I might as well have that magic number. Yeah, but. And so, what’s funny is I’m totally motivated by that. I’m totally motivated because I do believe things, quote unquote, happen for a reason.
00;16;54;06 – 00;17;11;21
Unknown
I know that that sounds terrible, but when when one thing falls apart that seems devastating. I don’t look at it like that. I’m like, there’s a reason that wasn’t supposed to happen. It’s disappointing. Grieve it for a couple minutes, but then something better is going to come along. And that’s what’s been happening, which is really cool. So really excited to go to the Florida Keys.
00;17;11;21 – 00;17;29;23
Unknown
Remember we went there. Oh yeah. really excited to do that. I’m sure I’ll have some stories. I’m sure, you know. Oh, yeah. Yeah, there may be a chance I’m going fishing. Did I have a dream last night? Because I was doing all the fishing. I’m chartering 13 fishing boats. And, Did I have a dream last night that you and I were on this?
00;17;29;26 – 00;17;45;01
Unknown
Not a cruise ship, but we were fishing, and it was huge. Swordfish. Oh, God. And you were the one pulling it into the boat? Yeah. Of course. And I’m the one that’s like, get that shit away from. Yeah, I don’t know, I don’t like it’s. No, it’s. And I was like that. It was like coming real close I don’t.
00;17;45;02 – 00;18;01;02
Unknown
Yeah, yeah. It was just us. Yeah. We’re just fishing. Just the two of us. Yeah, yeah. But then who was driving the boat, captain. Oh, we had no, there was like a crew. Oh, okay. That’s good. Yeah, yeah. So it was. It was real weird. And then I had a real weird dream the night before about a person.
00;18;02;19 – 00;18;27;21
Unknown
Oh yeah. So yeah we’ll talk about, we’ll talk about that later. That was next level. Speaking of dreams, this is, this is so tangential. But Mark comes up this morning. from being downstairs and he’s the guy I had this dream and it was about flooding and there’s so much water. And then he’s like, your dad pops his head out, and I’m looking for Carter, and he’s telling me this whole story that then leads into a conversation.
00;18;27;21 – 00;18;48;27
Unknown
He’s like, oh, speaking of Carter, he said, I was just downstairs and we were watching this thing on Michael Jordan on TV and how one of the games that Michael Jordan was playing, they had one of the audience members come down and shoot the ball to try and win. You know what? Our money. Yeah, right. And so the guy shot and made it, which is not something you would ever I mean from like half court.
00;18;48;27 – 00;19;13;18
Unknown
Oh like. Yeah. Oh, father. Right. Like he made this unsuitable shot and ends up winning $1 million. But the insurance company never paid it out. So Michael Johnson. Johnson. Jordan. Jordan. Well, there’s a Michael Johnson. Well yeah there is, but that’s not it. Oh was it Jordan. Jordan. Yeah. More like from Space Jam. Yeah yeah yeah Michael Jordan okay.
00;19;14;23 – 00;19;39;15
Unknown
Michael Jordan gets the Bulls and yeah, he himself to pay this man $1 million. He earned it. Damn it. I know which I which I very much appreciated. Which then led Carter to be like, oh, I think Michael Jordan has, like, billions of dollars and marks, like. Yeah, you know, probably he’s still making money off merch, you know, just associated with his name.
00;19;39;15 – 00;20;03;28
Unknown
He’s incredibly famous. And Carter’s like, well, it’s kind of like us at our house. You know, we have millions of dollars as well. And Marcus. Yeah, what do we think? So. And he’s like, yeah. And he goes, what makes you think that? We have millions of dollars? And he goes, mom, she has a podcast, I love him, I love that shirt.
00;20;04;00 – 00;20;22;29
Unknown
By the way, I know you didn’t look it up, but, 3.2 billion is his net worth. Oh, okay. Okay with a B. So that is a really well lawyer things. So we used to think we were rich because we live in a raised ranch and our living room was upstairs. She’s like nobody else. Nobody else has a living room.
00;20;23;00 – 00;20;42;05
Unknown
And hi, I’m Sarah and I’m like, what? Yeah, yeah, I was growing up. You have the funniest things. I love this growing up. All right. So now I’m going to let you into a little bit of my past. Oh, boy. Okay. You know, here we go. Okay, so I grew up in South Florida. Of course. As you know, I think, you know, because of the Gators.
00;20;42;12 – 00;21;06;16
Unknown
Right, right. so we live for the first, let’s see, from first grade until sixth grade, we lived in a mobile home, what they call a trailer. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Back in. Was it a double wide are single, double wide, single wide. I would have gone out of my mind. it was a double wide. It, some double wide a very nice.
00;21;06;16 – 00;21;21;16
Unknown
It was the Cadillac of mobile home. I bet it was great. But what could have been the the vigor of mobile mobile homes? I’m not sure. I mean, I’m a non-gender. I live in one right now. This is half my married year at the time. At the time, they were all the rage in the late 70s, early 80s.
00;21;21;22 – 00;21;43;02
Unknown
Right. I used to be so jealous of my friends that had actual houses. It’s like, oh, when you walk in your house, you don’t hear, oh, that’s so interesting. There aren’t, possums, a family of possums living under your house. That’s that’s really cool. see, these are things that I never I just don’t think about. I don’t compare what I have to other people.
00;21;43;02 – 00;22;00;25
Unknown
I never did when I was growing up. I mean, I grew up without a dad. Everybody else I knew had a dad. I wasn’t like going, wish I had a dad. It just wasn’t. This is what’s so fascinating is you’re so fascinating. Just so fast. We moved into an apartment. Scott’s in this moment where he is like, let me tell you about this thing, that I don’t know why I feel that way.
00;22;00;25 – 00;22;23;03
Unknown
So uncomfortable with any feelings that come up for Scott about his trailer home that you immediately go to. Oh, I don’t know why everything’s so great. I didn’t even know if we had about a trailer. Here I am over here like I’m only. I’m only, you know, speaking of, I’m looking with through today’s lens. oh. Time.
00;22;23;03 – 00;22;51;18
Unknown
At the time, it wasn’t like we were ashamed of it. Okay. No. Okay. All right, just clarify. But when I went to my friend’s houses, who had a house and they had, like, a yard, and, you know, it was it was cool. Okay, well, different because I hadn’t lived in a house before. Okay. Actually, from the time that we moved to Florida, when I was five, I didn’t live into an honest like real house until I was 18.
00;22;51;20 – 00;23;09;21
Unknown
Oh, we lived in the trailer home. We lived in apartments, and we lived in a townhouse. So it wasn’t till I was 18 till my parents actually bought a house that I. We lived in a house. Wow. And that was a big deal for me. It was huge. It was like a house with a pool and a yard.
00;23;09;23 – 00;23;27;13
Unknown
Moving on. that. Oh my gosh. See, I’m in my mind. I’m like, Phillip, can we move to an apartment so we don’t have to mow the lawn? There’s a well, as I got older, I did appreciate the apartment living a little bit. Yes, it’s a lot of pluses for the clowns. Oh, we had the clowns that lived next door.
00;23;27;13 – 00;23;50;18
Unknown
Wow. That’s going to be another stop starting next time. If you ever get to hang out with Kelly, ask her about the clown. So her family from Tennessee in the apartment next to us, and there was like 50 people living in that room, like a little clown on the clowns. Yeah. So you’re saying that it’s funny how people’s or kids appreciation for what rich is?
00;23;50;18 – 00;24;13;04
Unknown
Yeah. Yeah. Differs. Yeah. Right. Yeah. It’s based on your own. Your own personal experience. Of course it. Well, Taylor Taylor says to me, I just got a new car and, she goes, oh, God, mom. I go, what? She goes, my friends already think we’re rich. Now this just confirms the deal. And I said, why? And she’s. And I think it’s because our house is picked up.
00;24;13;06 – 00;24;33;10
Unknown
Oh, because you don’t live in a shithole. I’m like, what about I go? Everything I buy is from the goodwill’s. I go, what makes it rich? I think it’s just because it’s esthetically pleasing and it’s picked up big and she’s like the bar. The bar is low bar and I think, wow, you know, it’s just really funny to me.
00;24;33;10 – 00;25;05;16
Unknown
But you’re right. Kids, kids interpretations. Very interesting. Yeah. I, I said, what did you say? Mark? And he is like, well, I felt left out. And so I said, you know, your dad makes money too. And I said, wow. Yeah. oh, what? I here’s what I really appreciate about that, Mark, is I really appreciate that you were able to identify that you felt left out in the conversation because before you would just be like, I told them, your dad makes money.
00;25;05;16 – 00;25;28;22
Unknown
He does. Well, dad brings home a paycheck, right? And I would have been like, that’s such an odd thing to say, right? But now he’s really starting to like, enter in the feeling component of why he sings. Like he’s letting me into some of the details about why he’s thinking the way that he is. It’s very helpful for someone who’s literally like me, because I’m usually like, whoa, we went where?
00;25;28;28 – 00;25;52;18
Unknown
What are you? We couldn’t just let that be like, right? So just him saying the word, I felt left out, right? I’m like, thank you. Really appreciate that. And then I was like, stop telling him that. I probably corrected him. It was probably like, yeah, so what? So yeah, your mom makes millions on a podcast on the let him let him think that that’s the case because it lands differently when he’s like, can we go get a new Jersey?
00;25;52;18 – 00;26;12;11
Unknown
I’m like, nope. Right. Well why not? Right, right. Because he doesn’t understand it has to do with money. It has everything to do with the fact that your mom has power to say, I don’t want to go to new Jersey on new Jersey. And unless a new sports, new sports Jersey. That’s funny, that’s funny. Well, it a new Jersey.
00;26;12;11 – 00;26;36;01
Unknown
I mean, it’s all bad driving, horrendous driving. It’s not even it’s not even the podcast. It’s the fact that the podcast is on YouTube. Oh yeah. That’s the part. It’s like we’re on YouTube when when we’re like friends with Mr. Beast, right? Oh yeah. But like the girls soccer team, the coach at the end of the year puts a compilation of all the pictures and then shows it through YouTube and they’re like, oh my God, we’re famous.
00;26;36;01 – 00;26;58;01
Unknown
Yeah, we’re on the YouTube. It’s it’s not even a shared link. But yeah, just because it’s on YouTube. Yeah. My favorite part is when Mark’s like, a mom doesn’t make money on her podcast. Carter’s like I’m like yeah I got that all battle hardened over here. Fool proof. Doesn’t matter what you tell that kid. He’s real clear who his mom is, what his mom does whether it’s true or not.
00;26;58;01 – 00;27;15;28
Unknown
Right, right, right. He’s he’s the kid that you know, when he goes up and starts talking about his experiences in life and he’s like, it was my mom. That’s my mom who made all the money. It was my mom who was famous. My mom, you know, worked a lot. My mom did it all right. Like, I’m really crafting the story over here, and then Mark’s over here.
00;27;15;28 – 00;27;37;25
Unknown
Like, what about me? Well, I told you. I told you what my soccer mom said to me the other day. She was like, my son came up to me, he’s five. My son, I’m tucking him into bed and and he goes, mom, I can’t wait to be a dad. And she goes, oh, really? Why? And he goes, because guys don’t do anything.
00;27;37;27 – 00;27;42;22
Unknown
I don’t see your bubble out there. So.
00;27;42;25 – 00;28;00;14
Unknown
Dad’s got. Dad’s got it made. You don’t have to do anything. That’s a good a good that’s a running joke. That’s a running joke at our house. Because my dad, when he was a girl, when I was growing up, my mom would be all, like, ragged, running around doing everything you possibly can. And I would be like, daddy, you gonna help with the dishes?
00;28;00;14 – 00;28;18;25
Unknown
And he’d go, I can’t. The cat’s on my lap. It’s the salad. I say, what I can’t, the cat’s on my lap, the cat’s on my lap. Is that the thing that we use all the time in my house? I’ll be upstairs watching TV, you know, doing whatever. And then Mark will be like, hey, could you come help with that?
00;28;18;25 – 00;28;34;05
Unknown
I’m like, I can’t, I know cat’s out of my now. Now it’s the dogs on my lap. I have a little dog. You do not want to go? Yeah. When to disturb. Yeah, right. You look over at the cat is absolutely not on Mark’s lap, but he’s on his phone and he’s like a cat. The cat’s on my lap.
00;28;34;07 – 00;28;56;02
Unknown
That’s where he is. okay. All right. Scott, so what we’re doing today is I asked Scott to bring us an empathy problem. I love it and to not tell us about it. Oh, boy. So you’re getting the real and raw here with Rebecca and Aaron because we don’t know anything about this. So we’re just going to have to answer this completely on the fly, which is my favorite.
00;28;56;02 – 00;29;12;24
Unknown
And tells me why we’re perfect for radio, because all we need is the call in show component where someone’s like, hey, I got to tell you what’s happening right now, and you know how we handle this? And then I’m like, here’s how we handle it. And you’re like, nope, here’s how we handle it. And then we’re like, sorry.
00;29;12;24 – 00;29;35;01
Unknown
We left you with mixed advice. I’m sure you have a good day. And then Scott’s like, I’m kind of in between the two of them, right. Okay. Thank you. We’ve left you with nothing. Thank you for calling. Yep. All right, so hit it. All right, Scott, we’re ready for you. At least we think we are. okay, so this is a parenting empathy problem.
00;29;35;01 – 00;30;07;29
Unknown
Oh, I got this, and I don’t I hopefully it doesn’t take me too long to get to the. I’ll skip right to the empathy problem of this. Okay. And there, I had a conversation with my mother yesterday, which, made me very upset because she was essentially judging my parenting without outwardly saying, I’m judging you, but she likes to give me advice that, it doesn’t.
00;30;08;01 – 00;30;34;13
Unknown
It’s not helpful because it doesn’t work with the day. It doesn’t? It’s advice from 45, 50 years ago. It just doesn’t work today. It doesn’t work. And you’re also I got this one. I got so and also she you know, she’s in Florida. She has not been around my kids but a few but a handful of times in the course of their lives and only knows what we say about them.
00;30;34;15 – 00;30;56;22
Unknown
She doesn’t know them fully, even though she’s their grandmother, and she feels like she knows them because they’re family. She doesn’t know them. So she it’s it’s not, helpful for her to give me advice. And it’s not there’s a there’s a way of giving advice and there’s a way of telling people this is what you’re supposed to do and you’re not doing that.
00;30;57;09 – 00;31;24;10
Unknown
Yeah. so anyway, I texted Kelly and I said, you know, another, another time, I remind me to never tell my mom what’s going on with the kids and just say everything’s fine. Yeah. And so then I kind of told her what happened, and she begged me to text my mom to to tell her to give her a piece of her mind and I was like, you will not do that.
00;31;25;02 – 00;31;46;00
Unknown
there’s no she wanted to do it. Kelly. Kelly wanted to tell you wanted to text her and say that da da da da. And I said no. I said, first of all, I don’t because Kelly doesn’t talk to my mom ever. unless she absolutely has to. There’s no outward, you know, problem. But she chooses not to have those conversations because they always end up like mine just did.
00;31;46;23 – 00;32;08;13
Unknown
Where she gives advice and it’s like you don’t understand. That’s not the situation. I can’t go into it now. Da da da da da. So I said you’re not going to do that because ultimately her advice comes from a place of love. It comes from a place of trying to help. She may be wrong. She may not understand the situation exactly how it it does.
00;32;08;13 – 00;32;33;20
Unknown
You know it. She can’t relate to it because she’s never gone through it. She didn’t raise kids. at the height of social media. She didn’t raise kids at the height of, you know, the anxiety epidemic and, Covid things that happened that Covid caused with our kids. She she didn’t, did not have that experience. So she can’t take the experience that she had raising kids and apply it to today.
00;32;33;20 – 00;32;51;14
Unknown
Some of it, yes, perhaps, but some of it does not compute. and so that was the problem we had. And I was having the conversation with my mom and I’m like, look, I and the reason why I called her is because we were at Kelly and I were at a store and I saw this little, this little tchotchke that I thought my mom would like.
00;32;51;14 – 00;33;05;27
Unknown
And I bought it, and I sent it to her, and I was calling her to see if she got it, and it was really. It was just a spur of the moment thing. I wanted to get her. And then I realized Mother’s Day is coming up. So I made it a mother’s day present, and I put the card in there and everything nice.
00;33;05;28 – 00;33;19;29
Unknown
And so I was just calling to see if she got my present. And then that turned into, I don’t want to have this conversation. I don’t want to get an argument with you right now, but you don’t understand. Yeah. And that’s you saying that? Yes. That’s so. And then she, you know, and then she was like, okay, well, you know that add on.
00;33;19;29 – 00;33;48;28
Unknown
And we moved on and we’re good at that. she, you’re good at moving on. We’re good at moving on from those conversations. I withdrawal from those conversations and say, whatever, let’s talk about something else. And I change the subject. And she picks up on that and goes with it. Oh, but in that period of time where we talk about it, it gets really frustrating for me because I’m like, Abby this and Abby that.
00;33;48;28 – 00;34;09;01
Unknown
She’s having trouble with this and, well, why don’t you just make her do this? And why don’t you just make her do that and take this away and take that away? And I’m like, no, that’s not how I operate. Those aren’t the way. That’s not the way I do things sometimes in the past, perhaps. But, you know, that’s like.
00;34;09;04 – 00;34;30;26
Unknown
You know, device addiction is a big thing. And I see you smirking, Rebecca, because I know that you probably would know. Do shots with my mom. No no no no no no no. In my mind, I’m thinking you can’t you can’t discipline a teenager the same way you discipline an eight year old, right? You don’t just take things away.
00;34;30;28 – 00;34;52;17
Unknown
But I know you have. I know you have a lot of those sort of old fashioned views on raising kids. I do, but your children are older than mine. Yeah. So Scott’s like, I think there’s two different. There’s it’s different. It’s different when when you’re dealing with a natural situation specifically when you mentioned technology. Yeah. It’s just different.
00;34;52;18 – 00;35;07;09
Unknown
My eight year old, it doesn’t get the same privileges as my 16 year old. Right. You know what I mean? That’s that’s the only difference in my kids. When my kids were eight, they didn’t have the technology wasn’t there. Yeah. Right. So they had they were playing with my flip phone. Right, right. It’s a very different world with it.
00;35;07;13 – 00;35;24;09
Unknown
Yeah. You know, and they had like these cheesy little, what, what were those things. It was like a, it was some sort of a play game, but it was educational, you know, it looked like a laptop or like. Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, I know what you’re talking about. I can’t think of the name. Yeah. It was just, like a leapfrog or whatever.
00;35;24;09 – 00;35;47;25
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, it was, it was by leapfrog. So it had the little cartridges and stuff and they played, but it was all learning stuff, so. But they were like, we’re playing games, right? Emulated what we had as adults. Yeah. Now they just have better things than we do. Yeah. But, you know, I’m trying to explain to her about my daughter and her anxiety issues and her her her self-esteem issues and the problems she went through with that guy online.
00;35;47;27 – 00;36;15;08
Unknown
It’s which is still being litigated. It’s this whole big thing that affected her greatly. and I think she’s doing really well, but she has good days and she has bad days. And it’s really hard to sum up my daughter’s last four years in a sentence and explain it properly to my mom, and she’s automatically going to say, well, you know, she needs to go out and do this, and she needs to go out and do this.
00;36;15;08 – 00;36;35;22
Unknown
You need to make her do this stuff. I’m like, I’m not going to sit there and go, you know what? She tried. She’s she’s gone for two different jobs, got accepted, started working and couldn’t take it. Her anxiety was through the roof. She couldn’t do it, so she had to quit. We didn’t want her to quit. We tried to keep her in the job, but it was really affecting her, her life.
00;36;36;11 – 00;36;53;23
Unknown
and so we’re we said, all right, you don’t have to work. You’re only 17. You’re still, you know, going to school, but you do have to go to therapy. You do have to. We do have to find where this is coming from and how to fix it and how to help you. I have some questions. Okay. How old is mom?
00;36;53;26 – 00;37;24;25
Unknown
My mom is, 8281. Okay. Two 1942. So she’s 82. Does she live alone? She lives with my dad, who’s, 85. Is your dad what we would call emotionally available? someone really hard question and someone that he’s emotional, but maybe not emotionally available. Okay, there he is. He cries, like, at the drop of a hat. Yeah, but he’s not necessarily good at the feelings thing.
00;37;24;27 – 00;37;35;05
Unknown
The. I mean, you know, he’s he’s from the old school Irish, you know. Right. Right. What else does mom have outside of dad?
00;37;35;07 – 00;37;56;06
Unknown
Nothing. Nothing anymore. She used to work. She used to help. elderly, which I thought was funny because they’re, like, five years older than her. But, that’s like me helping Rebecca when we get to that extent. But she’s. You know, she used to take these ladies to their doctor’s appointments and go take them shopping and that kind of stuff, and she just retired from that.
00;37;56;09 – 00;38;21;29
Unknown
Yeah, well that’s interesting. When does she retire? Yeah. I’d say within the last six months or a year. Oh, wow. Okay. Have you noticed a shift in the, types of conversations or the arguments that you’ve been getting in in the last six months? No, it’s always been like it has been like this. It’s. I have two sisters in law, and they’re both saying they’re both are like, well, that’s mom.
00;38;21;29 – 00;38;53;11
Unknown
You know, you just they’re in Florida. So they deal with her on a regular basis. So they learn, they’ve learned to navigate that. But we moved away and Kelly was like, I ain’t dealing with that. And she hasn’t. Well how would you characterize your relationship with your mom. It’s good. It is. Yeah. And do you wish that the relationship was had a deeper connection or that you could have conversations with her that did not constantly lead to some form of argument?
00;38;53;13 – 00;39;13;04
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, that’d be great. It would be great if I could tell her what’s going on with my family and have her just listen, because. Why? Because that’s what I want. Why? Why else? Outside of what you want? What would it mean to you if that was the type of relationship you had with your mom? What do you mean?
00;39;13;06 – 00;39;28;25
Unknown
What would it mean to you to be able to have that type of relationship where you could call your mom and you could talk to her and you could tell her what’s going on and on the other end of the line, she’s saying things like, oh my gosh, that sounds so difficult. You know what, Scott, though, here’s what I know about you.
00;39;28;27 – 00;39;54;21
Unknown
You’re super smart and your super capable. And so is Kelly. She she does that. She does that. I just think that when it comes to my kids, she automatically has to tell me what we should be doing as opposed to saying, well, you’re a good parent, so I’m sure you’re going to do the right thing. That’s all I really want.
00;39;55;03 – 00;40;15;10
Unknown
you know, unless I say, mom, what if I do? I deal with this situation, but that’s not what I’m saying. She asks me how the kids are, and I say, well, you know, so-and-so’s having a problem with this. Well, why tell me about that part? That part I think is fascinating. What I don’t want to say too much on the podcast is because I know not about the specifics.
00;40;15;10 – 00;40;36;26
Unknown
Okay. But when when she says House, the kids. Yeah. What part of you wants to share the details and the information as opposed to saying, kids are good kids? Yeah, I want to share. I want to tell her, I want to answer her question. If she asks me how the kids are, she’s asking me because she cares and I want to give her the answer.
00;40;36;26 – 00;40;52;27
Unknown
I want to tell her. I want her to know what’s going on with my kids. You know, I don’t want her to think everything’s fine. If it’s not fine, if it is fine, then that’s what I’ll tell her. But if it’s not fine, I want to say Sean’s doing this. John’s doing this. Abby’s doing this. There’s this problem.
00;40;52;27 – 00;41;13;05
Unknown
There’s that problem. You know, because that’s how. That’s how life is. Life is not like everything’s fine. No matter how much you want to, you know, pretend it is. But there’s always something going on. And it’s easy to to when you have someone. If someone asks you that, you know, unless she’s just asking to to, you know, like saying, hey, how are you feeling today?
00;41;13;05 – 00;41;29;07
Unknown
Or hey, how are you doing? And then someone answers you and they’re like, well. And you’re like, oh shit. But I don’t think that’s the way it is. I think she legitimately wants to know because she cares, because they’re her grandkids and I’m the baby of the family, my bro. Both my brothers are ten and 11 years older than me.
00;41;29;07 – 00;41;56;01
Unknown
So they were, you know, out of the house. I was still a little kid. so in a lot of ways, I’m the I’m like an only child. I have a lot of thoughts about this. I’m curious, but where where would you go. What were what would your thoughts be. What what are your thoughts. I can I can absolutely relate to wanting to just share.
00;41;56;04 – 00;42;18;07
Unknown
And I’m the type of person that I unless I specifically ask for advice, I’m not looking for it. Just because I’m sharing something with you doesn’t mean I want your opinion. In fact, I don’t want your opinion at all. I’m just sharing it so I absolutely can understand your feelings of I want. I want her to be in the know, but I’m not looking for a solution and when they do offer up things, it’s nice.
00;42;18;07 – 00;42;34;27
Unknown
And I’ve learned this a lot in my life. I just take people’s advice with a grain of salt and think, okay, you’re so way off base, it’s fine. But you know, so I can understand that. And I also understand and relate to the fact of the generation difference. I mean, my mom’s not in her 80s, but she’s in her 60s.
00;42;34;27 – 00;42;55;16
Unknown
And there’s a significant generation difference. Significant. It’s just different. You know, and the other component with my family is I grew up with the single mom and no dad. My mom was the end all be all decision maker. There was no conversation to be had. Yeah I’m married I’m married in a house and with two different family values.
00;42;55;16 – 00;43;21;17
Unknown
And we have to come together and raise our kids as a family unit. So sometimes my mom gets very confused about why things would happen a certain way because she’s like, that’s not how we would have done it. I’m like, I know, but I don’t get to pull rank. Right. You know, so and I can relate with what you’re saying to Scott because my parents live in an in-law suite attached to my home and they are in their 70s.
00;43;21;19 – 00;44;06;26
Unknown
And one of the unintended side effects that I did not know was going to be a part of that experience was how much their opinions and how much any past, relationship dynamics, family dynamics existed when I was growing up. We’re going to transfer over into them living next door and little things like, I’ve been attuned to the ways in which my dad displeases things or is, you know, silently judging the shit out of something over the last 42 years because I lived with him for 25 of those years.
00;44;06;28 – 00;44;46;00
Unknown
And so now when he lives next door and he verbally will not say how he feels about something, it does not mean I’m any more or less in the know about how he feels about that particular thing. And one of the dynamic issues you’re talking about is alive and well for me, and I think is alive and well for all people when it comes to their parents, is that if we have not appropriately and I don’t know the best way to do this, but appropriately let go of or changed the relationship dynamic from when we were little, which is mom and dad know best.
00;44;46;00 – 00;45;07;22
Unknown
Mom and dad are the decision makers. Mom and dad’s role is to keep me safe. Mom and dad’s role is to tell me things that I don’t know about myself to educate me. If that doesn’t change throughout the course of in moving into adulthood, then you see the same family experience play itself out at the age of 50 and 81.
00;45;07;22 – 00;45;40;10
Unknown
Yeah, at the age of 42 and 74. Right. Like there’s still this ingrained, almost like it was required of us for survival at such a young age, so embedded that we look for the approval of our parents, even if that parent is not connected to us in some way, even if that parent was a really shitty parent, and especially if that parent played a really meaningful role in our life.
00;45;40;13 – 00;46;02;00
Unknown
And I, I saw it even with my mom and her mom as my grandma was dying. Still, my mom was only child is having this feeling of have I done enough? Is it good enough? Is it good enough for my mom? Would she approve of what was happening here? even my my grandma was losing her mind toward the end, and it was still very much this, like.
00;46;02;06 – 00;46;42;19
Unknown
Well, grandma would have liked it this particular way, right? My mom was in her early 70s or her late 60s, and her mother was close to 90, still experiencing that type of relationship dynamic. Right. and I just find that fascinating. And I found that to be one of the things that stuck out to me about your story, Scott, is we as children always have the desire to connect in a meaningful way with our significant parent, whether that be the mom or the dad, or maybe it’s a guardian, or maybe it’s a grandma or whatever.
00;46;42;21 – 00;47;25;06
Unknown
And it is the one place that we turn to for unconditional love and support. And when we don’t get that, whether that’s outright or whether that’s through advice or whether that’s through anything that feels displeasing in some way, it is so incredibly hurtful because is there the one person in the world that’s supposed to be the safe place where you go to have these conversations, where that relationship is off, however, is that that person, that mom, that parent, that guardian has also not shifted their role, which is that of caretaking and all they care about.
00;47;25;06 – 00;47;45;01
Unknown
At the end of the day, like you said, Scott, she’s coming from a place of love and compassion. She wants to fix it. She she wants to fix it. She wants to to solve your problems. Right? That that’s really what it is. And I and I hear that and I get that. But at the same time, yeah, it’s really it’s difficult it’s frustrating because you, there’s, it’s unavoidable.
00;47;45;01 – 00;48;05;29
Unknown
But there’s a, there’s a level of judgment in that, that you feel whether or not it’s intentional or it’s subtle, whatever, it’s there. And so you can’t help but get on the defensive while you’re doing it wrong. You should do it this way. And now it’s like, now you’re jumping on my back about how I know the kind of parent I am.
00;48;06;14 – 00;48;25;07
Unknown
And and know what your unconditional approval. I want your unconditional I if I’m going to run into a street maybe let me know. But otherwise at the end of the day, even if I’m making a really terrible decision, what I want to feel from you is it’s fine. We’re going to get through this. I love you no matter what.
00;48;25;07 – 00;48;46;28
Unknown
It’s unconditional. And, you know, in the past I have tried to say. I said, like, I know that you’re just trying to help mom, but there’s so much involved with this that it’s really hard for me to go through and explain it all. So I, you know, but even if you did explain it all, it still wouldn’t be.
00;48;46;28 – 00;49;04;24
Unknown
No, I understood, I don’t yeah, but you know, I say, I know you’re coming in, you’re coming from a place to, to try to help me. And I appreciate that. But you know, your, your advice actually is not translating with today. It’s, there’s a lot of other stuff and, and I leave it at that and she’ll go, oh all right, well fine.
00;49;04;26 – 00;49;31;21
Unknown
And then I feel like I’ve hurt her feelings. That part right there is the saddest part of all of this for me, because this is what happens constantly in relationships, no matter who it is. You have two people that feel hurt, two people that feel unheard, two people that feel like they did not get their needs met. And then it’s an agree to disagree and we’re just going to move on and let that go.
00;49;31;21 – 00;50;03;02
Unknown
Right. Or we don’t ever let it go. It’s carries with us into the next conversation. It just sounds different. Right. And that is the part that I don’t think anyone is so properly or adequately trained at being able to heal their own self in that conversation, or to heal the relationship in that conversation. And I will give you an example of how I did this recently, and it was really hard for me to do, and it’s hard for me to do, which you both know means it’s really effin hard for other people to do, because I do this stuff all the time, right?
00;50;03;05 – 00;50;26;05
Unknown
I had a situation with my dad that I did not like, how that conversation went. It actually really made me angry and I was seething upstairs. And so the very next day, I needed to take my car to the, the car place, car shop. and I see that my mom has her coat on. She and my dad are ready to go take me to the car dealership.
00;50;26;05 – 00;50;47;13
Unknown
And I say, actually, mom, I’m just going with dad. And she’s like, oh, okay, okay. All right. And she goes outside and she’s like, Aaron, just wanted to go with you to the car dealership, so I’m just going to stay here. She says she has something she wants to talk to you about now, in this moment. You know, John, no matter how military this man is, he’s a little nervous right now.
00;50;47;13 – 00;51;09;06
Unknown
Well, you are very scary. Well, and I’m nervous for you. I would never show, but I’m like, this is my idea, right? Right. This dynamic is alive and well, right? So I have thought all night about how I was going to address the situation with him. And boy, there was a wide variability. One started with who the f do you think?
00;51;09;06 – 00;51;41;00
Unknown
Right. One started with, you know, I might be wrong about this, but and thankfully I landed on much more of a middle ground. So after he drops me off at the car, I say, why don’t we go to the coffee shop? He’s like, okay. And I said, I’m going to start with this. I feel so sad that you grew up in a decade and in an environment that did not allow men to have feelings greater than the need for control, or greater than the need for anger.
00;51;41;02 – 00;52;02;22
Unknown
And I’m seeing that play out in our family dynamic in myriad ways that we don’t need to get into the details of. But I’m noticing myself react differently to you, and it makes me really sad that as we move into this third phase of life, I find myself having feelings about you that are not the feelings that I want to have now.
00;52;02;22 – 00;52;29;16
Unknown
This man sat there hard, really effing hard and hard to say and hard to hear. Then we ended up in a coffee shop for 2.5 hours. Yeah. Tears, Cinnamon rolls with everything you could possibly imagine was happening here. It was a beautiful conversation, and one of the things I had said in that conversation was, I don’t care how old we get, your approval means something to me.
00;52;29;18 – 00;53;06;00
Unknown
I don’t want it to mean something to me. At the age of 42, honestly, I want to be able to just be like, oh, well, whatever. That’s my dad in it. Does it mean something to me? And I have felt my entire existence. I know you better than almost any other human being in this world, and I know you better in some ways than mom does, because I have a different interaction pattern with you, and I need you to know that I see you, and I need you to know that I know that you’re an emotional person, and I need you to know that every time you give advice, you have opinions, you get angry.
00;53;06;00 – 00;53;20;26
Unknown
You respond in a certain way. I know it’s coming from love, and I’m going to be real honest with you. If it wasn’t, we wouldn’t be sitting here right now. It would be different, right? And you, you know the difference. Yes. You can feel it. Feel it, you know. Yes, I know this is where this is coming from.
00;53;20;26 – 00;53;38;05
Unknown
And that’s why we’re having this conversation. I said, so what I need you to know is I need you to hear me say that every single opinion you have pierces me in some way. It makes me feel like I’m not good enough. It makes me feel like I’m not smart enough. It makes me feel like I’m making bad decisions.
00;53;38;05 – 00;54;05;15
Unknown
And I’m disappointing you. Like I’m a failure. Like, I have a brother who’s seven years older, so it makes me feel like if I do not serve in the way that I’m supposed to, or make the right decisions, that you will have a more favorable response to Brian than you do to me. And I’m okay with it being equal, but I’m not okay with it feeling like you have different, you know, feel ings or care or love.
00;54;05;18 – 00;54;34;07
Unknown
It makes me feel like it’s not conditional. And in his response was quite fascinating. It was. I never mean for it to come across like that in. My response was, it doesn’t matter how you mean for it to come across, it still feels the same to me. And I don’t need you to address what you meant. I need you to see me and how this has a reaction for me.
00;54;34;29 – 00;54;55;24
Unknown
I then moved on and gave it an example. I said, do you remember the time that Mark was spray painting his office in the basement? And he’s like, oh yeah, yeah, I do. I said that one small example was me in a complete tizzy, thinking to myself, I want Mark to be able to spray paint his office.
00;54;55;24 – 00;55;15;27
Unknown
It’s his office. I don’t care what it looks like. I don’t care if he wants roll on paint or spray paint. I want him to feel comfortable in that space. I’ve wanted to make that his space, and I want him to feel comfortable in his own home. While that’s happening, I’m thinking to myself the whole time, John is not okay with this.
00;55;16;00 – 00;55;38;27
Unknown
There’s not enough ventilation. He’s having concerns about the fumes that are downstairs. He’s wondering where the spray paint is going. He’s wondering if Mark has the escape window, egress window open. Even if he has the egress window open, there’s not enough fans down there, right? I said that one small thing. I said, what should I do? Dad, this is rhetorical.
00;55;39;04 – 00;55;57;10
Unknown
What should I do in that situation? Do I support my husband and making sure that he has an office that he wants, even if he’s spray painting, which wouldn’t have been my first choice? Or do I appease my father, who I know is going to be upset and have anxiety and difficulty with the fact that this is how he chose to do it?
00;55;57;12 – 00;56;18;09
Unknown
I said, dad, this is about spray paint. So now have it be about my kid. Now have it be about my marriage now have it be about all of these other things that are just so much more important. And you can see how that intensifies. And his response in that moment was, I never looked at it that way.
00;56;18;14 – 00;56;55;03
Unknown
And I never mean to put you in that position. What he said next was the most important part. I’m going to do a better job of controlling my own reactions, of wanting you to be okay so that you really can be okay. And I’m like that is effing profound. And what I hear you saying, Scott, is your mom needs to do a better job of controlling her need for you to be okay, for the ability to make space for you to actually be okay.
00;56;55;16 – 00;57;12;15
Unknown
this is an example where empathy comes in. People are trying really hard. They want you to be okay. They want you to have a good life. They want all of these things for you. But when you want all of that and your want and need for that to happen for me is greater than how I’m genuinely feeling in that moment.
00;57;12;15 – 00;57;22;15
Unknown
That’s when we’re running into these types of issues. Hell of a way to end an episode. Seriously.
00;57;22;17 – 00;57;51;26
Unknown
You you use your words prettier than a $20. Ha ha ha ha ha ha, I loved that. Me too. Isn’t empathy amazing? Well we’re amazing. I don’t know about all this empathy stuff. That’s fine. I accept you wherever you are. Oh, God, I love you. I love you too. And if you love us, please like and subscribe to More Love the Power of Empathy podcast wherever you get your podcasts.
00;57;52;04 – 00;58;01;22
Unknown
See you next time.
